Is Beauty Really Subjective? (Earth, choice, hell, America, experience)

[Lindzus]

I've always somewhat prided myself on finding beauty in different places than many people do. However, I've recently noticed that if someone is put in front of me (on TV or some other such nonsense) and it is said that they are beautiful, I agree. Once I was more conscious of this fact, I could find the same exact details in that person that are found in every other person that comes in and they say are beautiful. There are such obvious trends these days (in America...as I know little about trends in other countries.) So, it seems like anyone who fits the current trends is considered beautiful, and I can be convinced that they are beautiful very easily. They sway my opinion, in a way.

However, outside of those trends, I can find beauty in other people who lack those details. It depends greatly on my mood, and almost on a different set of tastes.

I'm not really sure if I've explained myself completely, but at the moment my mind has drawn a blank on further explanations.

[Willamena]

Originally Posted by Fluffy

Universal agreement on a particular belief is irrelevant with regards to whether that belief is subjective or objective. If something is objectively true then it is true regardless of how many people view it as true not because most people view it as true.

Therefore, agreement about beauty does not mean that beauty is objective. Similarly, disagreement about beauty does not mean that it is subjective. Beauty is subjective because it is based on emotion rather than reason.

The OP wasn't addressing a conformity of agreeance, so much as facts. It is a fact that a large majority of people will find certain things to be things 'of beauty' whether or not they agree with anyone else on the matter. Symmetry is a perfect example.

[Faint]

Originally Posted by Sunstone

If notions of what's beautiful or not are truly subjective, how does one account for there being such agreements on what's beautiful?

Evolution. This is an open/shut case. Far too many studies on the matter to cite here. Start with The Evolution of Desire by David M. Buss if you're inclined to know more. To summarize some of the main points, there are certain (physical) traits that are undeniably universal in regards to what's attractive. For example, in women it's youth, health, symmetry, and approximately a .70 waist-to-hip ratio. The "subjective" part of beauty is whatever a culture adds to these specific traits. Tan or pale skin for example; hair color, clothing style, etc.

[Fluffy]

The OP wasn't addressing a conformity of agreeance, so much as facts. It is a fact that a large majority of people will find certain things to be things 'of beauty' whether or not they agree with anyone else on the matter. Symmetry is a perfect example.

I realise. I was pointing out the mistake of counterposing subjectivity with near universal agreement since:
1) Something that is subjective can still be universally agreed upon
2) Something that is objective can be heavily contested

If the majority of people find a symmetrical face attractive then beauty is still a subjective quality because beauty is not a primary quality. Something is only beautiful when somebody is there to consider it beautiful as opposed to objective, primary qualities such as length, texture etc.