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  #21  
Old 03-25-2005, 07:52 AM
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You were right this first time No*s
The BB is just a model.
The evidence that supports it is nowhere near as complete or unquestionable as that which supports evolutioSpinks can`t even give me evidence for The Particle yet here he is proselytizing.

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  #22  
Old 03-25-2005, 03:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linwood
You were right this first time No*s
The BB is just a model.
The evidence that supports it is nowhere near as complete or unquestionable as that which supports evolutioSpinks can`t even give me evidence for The Particle yet here he is proselytizing.
Well, it seems that I'm going to sit back with some popcorn and a coke and enjoy myself. I'll let you two who are more knowledgable than I duke it out .
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  #23  
Old 03-25-2005, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Melody
I think it will eventually be discarded. Over the last several months, NPR has interviewed several prominent scientists who are beginning to say that it appears the big bang theory is not panning out but they're not sure what to replace it with. They're going to "study" the situation further though.
Those silly scientists, and their "studies". I share your sentiment, Melody. Who needs to study things when we already have a perfectly good story about a woman made from a rib and a talking snake?

Quote:
Originally Posted by linwood
You were right this first time No*s
The BB is just a model.
The evidence that supports it is nowhere near as complete or unquestionable as that which supports evolutioSpinks can`t even give me evidence for The Particle yet here he is proselytizing.
Don't listen to linwood's alarmingly-Creationist-like dribble, No*s. I'll leave the density of the universe debate to another thread, but what's important here is that the BB, like evolution, is both a set of facts and a dynamic theory set up to explain those facts. Scientists might argue about how exactly Dinosaurs are related to ostriches, for example...or what exactly the universe was like 14 billion years ago...but it is an undisputed fact that species change over time due to natural selection, and similarly it is a fact that the universe we live in is the result of the expansion of the ancient primitive universe.

linwood, I think, is confused because "The Big Bang" sounds like a singular catastrophic event that happened a long time ago, when in fact BB theory is about how our universe has changed/is changing over time (just like evolutionary theory). Just as we can currently observe species evolving, we can also currently observe the universe "Bang!"-ing.
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  #24  
Old 03-25-2005, 03:39 PM
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Scientists might argue about how exactly Dinosaurs are related to ostriches, for example...or what exactly the universe was like 14 billion years ago...but it is an undisputed fact that species change over time due to natural selection, and similarly it is a fact that the universe we live in is the result of the expansion of the ancient primitive universe.

Yep

linwood, I think, is confused because "The Big Bang" sounds like a singular catastrophic event that happened a long time ago,

Nope

when in fact BB theory is about how our universe has changed/is changing over time (just like evolutionary theory). Just as we can currently observe species evolving, we can also currently observe the universe "Bang!"-ing.

Yep

I have no problem with the Big Bang.
I only have a problem with all the cool extra options they attached to it for funs n giggles.
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  #25  
Old 03-25-2005, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linwood
I have no problem with the Big Bang.
I only have a problem with all the cool extra options they attached to it for funs n giggles.
You also dispute my assertion that the BB is both a model and a fact, just as Darwinian evolution is both model and fact. Do you stand by this contention?
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  #26  
Old 03-25-2005, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Spinkles
You also dispute my assertion that the BB is both a model and a fact, just as Darwinian evolution is both model and fact. Do you stand by this contention?
If you mean the model that starts at an infinitely dense particle before which niether space nor time existed and expands at a known rate verified by Hubbles constant up to the present time which has recently had Dark Energy incorporated into it to account for the discrepencies in rate of expansion then yes...I do stand by that contention.



Editted due to epicycle mix up
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  #27  
Old 03-25-2005, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linwood
If you mean the model that starts at an infinitely dense particle before which niether space nor time existed and expands at a known rate verified by Hubbles constant up to the present time which has recently had Dark Matter incorporated into it to account for the discrepencies in rate of expansion then yes...I do stand by that contention.
Dark matter was something hypothesized to explain the discrepencies in the rotations of galaxies....are you sure you didn't mean Dark Energy?

I think you might not be understanding what I am saying: I am not saying that the model of the big bang is a fact. I'm saying that the term "big bang theory" refers to two things--a set of facts, and an explanation of those facts. The term "evolutionary theory" also refers to both a set of facts and an explanation for them. I hope that helps.
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  #28  
Old 03-25-2005, 05:50 PM
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Dark matter was something hypothesized to explain the discrepencies in the rotations of galaxies....are you sure you didn't mean Dark Energy?

My apologies, I do mean dark energy.
I seem to get my epicycles mixed up al the time.
I think you might not be understanding what I am saying: I am not saying that the model of the big bang is a fact.

We have an 18 page thread filled with some pretty heavy implications by you towards what you are now telling me you aren`t saying.
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum...528#post125528

I'm saying that the term "big bang theory" refers to two things--a set of facts, and an explanation of those facts. The term "evolutionary theory" also refers to both a set of facts and an explanation for them. I hope that helps.

I`ve never disagreed with this outlook Spinks.
I`ve merely critisized some of those explanations for their lack of foundation.
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  #29  
Old 03-25-2005, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linwood
I`ve never disagreed with this outlook Spinks.
Oh, then I misunderstood you. I had just said
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Spinkles
The BB is not "just a model" No*s....like evolution, it is also a fact.
So when you said
Quote:
Originally Posted by linwood
You were right this first time No*s
The BB is just a model.
I took it to mean you disagreed that the BB was both a model and a fact.

Quote:
Originally Posted by linwood
We have an 18 page thread filled with some pretty heavy implications by you towards what you are now telling me you aren`t saying.
Perhaps you should ignore the "pretty heavy implications" and concentrate on what I've actually said. For example, I have said that I agree with you the infinite density of the early universe is not certain. I disagree that it is not a reasonable hypothesis.
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