Where do you get your morality?

[Storm]

Warren, you realize that I'm not saying one needs God to be moral, right?

[Warren Clark]

Originally Posted by painted wolf

No, not everyone does. That is the clinical definition of psychopathy.


Then you ignore a great amount of human history. Every culture has been able to convince itself that some other group was unworthy of basic humanity. That is how we justify wars, poverty and so on.
We have a biologically limited ability to empathize with the rest of our species, it's known as Dunbar's number.

Again yyou ignore most of human experience. Rape in particular is a very commonly accepted behavior, especially marital rape.

wa:do

Marital rape is accepted?
I don't think its "accepted". I think that people are ignorant of the subject.
There are the religiously insane that try to back it up with religion but that is a minority.

I mean one thing is for sure. Everyone's interest is the preservation of life.
Its why we keep homocidal-maniacs locked up.
Its why primitive humans give sacrifices.
Its why we have a judicial system.
As did every civilization have some form of one before us.

The moral objective in life is to preserve life.
That is the only moral objective.

Then you get into the seven deadly sins which are said to limit or cease life preservation.

[Storm]

Originally Posted by Warren Clark

The moral objective in life is to preserve life.
That is the only moral objective.

But it's not. Euthanasia, and hari kari both show that.

[idav]

Originally Posted by Storm

Haven't watched the vid yet, but I can't agree that morality is objective.

Even with a God, it's only objective with proof. Since proof is a fool's game in that context....

Morality can be based on objective evidences.

[Storm]

Originally Posted by idav

Morality can be based on objective evidences.

Well, I don't think that's quite the same thing, but please elaborate.

[idav]

Originally Posted by Storm

Well, I don't think that's quite the same thing, but please elaborate.

As an example we know that people need to be nurtured growing up to be mentally healthy. If kids are neglected and locked up all the time it would not be a good thing for them. Now it would just depend on what the goal is. If my goal is to raise a healthy kid or to destroy the kids psyche then I would know how to use objective means of attaining that goal. Just saying that god told me to do it this way wouldn't be an objective reason for having a certain morality.

[Storm]

Originally Posted by idav

As an example we know that people need to be nurtured growing up to be mentally healthy. If kids are neglected and locked up all the time it would not be a good thing for them. Now it would just depend on what the goal is. If my goal is to raise a healthy kid or to destroy the kids psyche then I would know how to use objective means of attaining that goal.

Agreed. That said the "goal" is the morality, don't you think?

Just saying that god told me to do it this way wouldn't be an objective reason for having a certain morality.

I think you're misreading me. I'm not arguing that God provides objective morality.

If God could be proven? Maybe, still arguable. But it can't, so moot point.

[idav]

Originally Posted by Storm

Agreed. That said the "goal" is the morality, don't you think?

Yes I think so. I don't think the problem really is having a different goal for the most part. People just have strange ways of trying to achieve and don't always use objective means which is why I bring up god. Though it would be no different with a vegan killing a kid with bad nutrition. We all want health I think so I wouldn't try and argue that misery and pain can somehow be moral.

[Storm]

Originally Posted by idav

Yes I think so. I don't think the problem really is having a different goal for the most part. People just have strange ways of trying to achieve and don't always use objective means which is why I bring up god. Though it would be no different with a vegan killing a kid with bad nutrition. We all want health I think so I wouldn't try and argue that misery and pain can somehow be moral.

Misery and pain are not always physical.

Warren said that the only objective morality is preserving life. I disagree, even that isn't objective. Where do you stand?

Please tell me the morals you think are objective.

[idav]

Originally Posted by Storm

Misery and pain are not always physical.

Warren said that the only objective morality is preserving life. I disagree, even that isn't objective. Where do you stand?

Please tell me the morals you think are objective.

It can be argued that not preserving life would go against the purpose of living in the first place. Would you agree that a person who wants to destroy their own life is not the result of a healthy mind? Instinct wants us to preserve ourselves otherwise something is broken.