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  #751  
Old 01-12-2008, 07:25 PM
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nutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
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Originally Posted by kadzbiz View Post
Now, you should already know my thoughts of the Bible, but at least a lot of its geographical, historical, literary records, flora/fauna, etc etc can be corroborated with plenty of evidence, whereas it appears the BOM cannot.
And therein lies the bias because much of these type of things can be corroborated in the BoM. Does it match the Bible - I don't think so. However, it's too extreme to say things in the Book of Mormon "cannot" be corroborated. Some things can and some things can't. That said, I'm not a literalist anyway.
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  #752  
Old 01-12-2008, 07:46 PM
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kadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on trees
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Originally Posted by nutshell View Post
.... it's too extreme to say things in the Book of Mormon "cannot" be corroborated. Some things can and some things can't. That said, I'm not a literalist anyway.
But how can the BoM talk about things, like say, coinage when metallic coins wheren't used in any part of ancient America, or horses used by Nephite armies when there weren't any horses in America at that time, or the large cities built by the Nephites when there's no archeological evidence of them, or the use of some crops like wheat when there is no evidence of such things? The only document that would have some credibility are the gold plates and yet they're not available for people to see and judge for themselves as say the Dead Sea Scrolls are today.
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  #753  
Old 01-12-2008, 07:56 PM
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nutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
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Originally Posted by kadzbiz View Post
But how can the BoM talk about things, like say, coinage when metallic coins wheren't used in any part of ancient America, or horses used by Nephite armies when there weren't any horses in America at that time, or the large cities built by the Nephites when there's no archeological evidence of them, or the use of some crops like wheat when there is no evidence of such things? The only document that would have some credibility are the gold plates and yet they're not available for people to see and judge for themselves as say the Dead Sea Scrolls are today.
This is a perfect example of when evidence DOES exist. I'll see if I can dig it up. I believe DeepShadow has this stuff at the tip of his fingers, but it might take me some time.
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  #754  
Old 01-12-2008, 08:02 PM
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kadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on trees
kadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on trees
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This is a perfect example of when evidence DOES exist. I'll see if I can dig it up. I believe DeepShadow has this stuff at the tip of his fingers, but it might take me some time.
More than happy to view what you present. Talking about digging up, why isn't the LSD church happy to have a archeological dig of the Hill Cumorah considering it would help confirm much of the events that the BoM depicts?
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  #755  
Old 01-12-2008, 08:03 PM
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nutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
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Here's something from mormon apologists about "coinage"

Coins in the Book of Mormon » FAIR Blog
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  #756  
Old 01-12-2008, 08:04 PM
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nutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
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Originally Posted by kadzbiz View Post
More than happy to view what you present. Talking about digging up, why isn't the LSD church happy to have a archeological dig of the Hill Cumorah considering it would help confirm much of the events that the BoM depicts?

I think most educated LDS recognize the likely fact that such a dig will turn up nothing. There are differing theories regarding this.

Again, I'm not a literalist so it's hard for me to put up any strong arguments.
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  #757  
Old 01-12-2008, 08:15 PM
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kadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on trees
kadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on trees
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Here's something from mormon apologists about "coinage"
Coins in the Book of Mormon » FAIR Blog
Interesting, but they talked about metal weights, which leads me to ask about metallurgy that must've been used for chariots etc, but again, there is no evidence of such metallurgical sites anywhere, are there?

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I think most educated LDS recognize the likely fact that such a dig will turn up nothing. There are differing theories regarding this......
My first thought is, "maybe the battles didn't happen"?
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  #758  
Old 01-12-2008, 09:53 PM
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Dirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfast
Dirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfast
Dirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfastDirty Penguin eats frubals for breakfast
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Originally Posted by kadzbiz View Post
Well, when you get your speakers working, watch it because there are many many points raised that don't sound biased to me (even if it was made from a biased point of view by those ministries) that require some pretty good answers. Now, you should already know my thoughts of the Bible, but at least a lot of its geographical, historical, literary records, flora/fauna, etc etc can be corroborated with plenty of evidence, whereas it appears the BOM cannot.

P.S. (edit) I would be happy to watch any doco that could provide credible evidence from recognised educated people of artifacts or a document trail, etc that would counter or answer any of the issues raised by the LHM doco.
Very interesting video. I watched the whole thing. It was very well done. I really appreciate the fact that credible souces were brought together to give information. I like the fact that archeologist were extremely knowledgeable in their field of study.

For some time now I have stayed out of forums that dealt with Mormonism or mormon content because I don't know enough to comment on their way of life. Like all other ways of life I have respect for them. I may not agree but to each his own.

I believe some questions do need answering though. Namely the lack of historical evidence as portrayed in the book of Morman. Again, I don't know very much about the book other than a couuple passages I have read and this video I have seen.

Kadzbiz thank you for the link. It was very insightful...........
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  #759  
Old 01-12-2008, 10:16 PM
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kadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on trees
kadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on treeskadzbiz thinks frubals grow on trees