christians - judging (LDS, faith, religion, Mormon)

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by Baerly

Wouldn't you agree that the word of God tells us to warn those in error.

Not by telling them they're going to Hell.

So it does matter which way we go. Not only that but the bible tells us that God uses Christians to preach to others and tell them the gospel,this would include the verses above.

You and I are forever going to take a different approach to preaching the gospel of Jesus Christ. Approximately 56,000 LDS missionaries are currently spreading the good news to people around the world. These people are converting at a rate of about 900 per day. They are converting because they find hope and peace in the teachings of Jesus Christ, not because they are afraid of spending an eternity in Hell. I suppose we could warn people that if they don't convert, they will be damned, but it would be dishonest for us to do so since that's not what we believe.

[sojourner]

People often offer the story of the rich man and Lazarus in the 16th chapter of Luke as evidence of God's justice and eternal punishment...Where is the justice in this story? Even when judged by the command of an "eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth," the rich man's sentence seems excessive. How do we justify punishing a lifetime of sin with an eternity of suffering? At what point are the scales balanced?

I can accept that repentance and transformation may require some to experience the misery they caused...Perhaps Hitler will repent only after experiencing some of the agony he wrought. Or perhaps he'll discover what I've discovered -- the deepest pain is the inward awareness of the hurt I've caused others. Regardless, I am unable to see how the eternal punishment of anyone could bring glory to God.

Love and punishment are not mutually exclusive. But parental punishment is never designed to inflict pain. It desires to redeem, shape, or protect. When it is excessive, it becomes abuse. Eternal punishment contradicts even the harshest concepts of justice. It defies God's commitment to restoring all things.

Fortunately, a violent and vengeful final Judgment is not the only Biblical image of our ultimate destiny. Paul writes, "He [God] has made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ, to put into effect when the times will have reached their fullness -- to bring all things in heaven and on earth together under one head, even Christ." (Eph. 1:9-10)

Justice is the end rather than the means. it is the result of God's gracious kingdom, not the tool to bring it about. It is making all things as they were intended to be.

Taken from If Grace is True, Gulley and Mulholland, Harper 2003, pp. 81-83

[Buttercup]

Originally Posted by sojourner

How do we justify punishing a lifetime of sin with an eternity of suffering? At what point are the scales balanced?

Exactly....it's not just. And above all god is just right?

...Perhaps Hitler will repent only after experiencing some of the agony he wrought.

It's almost impossible for me to imagine in the afterlife...when your soul must know there's a god....that wicked people would do anything other than repent. But, perhaps this is not for us to know.

I much appreciate this post, sojourner. Between you, luna and the LDS'ers...I'm thinking hell might not be as bad as I thought.

[lunamoth]

Originally Posted by sojourner

People often offer the story of the rich man and Lazarus in the 16th chapter of Luke as evidence of God's justice and eternal punishment...Where is the justice in this story? Even when judged by the command of an "eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth," the rich man's sentence seems excessive. How do we justify punishing a lifetime of sin with an eternity of suffering? At what point are the scales balanced?

I can accept that repentance and transformation may require some to experience the misery they caused...Perhaps Hitler will repent only after experiencing some of the agony he wrought. Or perhaps he'll discover what I've discovered -- the deepest pain is the inward awareness of the hurt I've caused others. Regardless, I am unable to see how the eternal punishment of anyone could bring glory to God.

Love and punishment are not mutually exclusive. But parental punishment is never designed to inflict pain. It desires to redeem, shape, or protect. When it is excessive, it becomes abuse. Eternal punishment contradicts even the harshest concepts of justice. It defies God's commitment to restoring all things.

Fortunately, a violent and vengeful final Judgment is not the only Biblical image of our ultimate destiny. Paul writes, "He [God] has made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ, to put into effect when the times will have reached their fullness -- to bring all things in heaven and on earth together under one head, even Christ." (Eph. 1:9-10)

Justice is the end rather than the means. it is the result of God's gracious kingdom, not the tool to bring it about. It is making all things as they were intended to be.

Taken from If Grace is True, Gulley and Mulholland, Harper 2003, pp. 81-83

I second Buttercup's post. Well said Soj.

And yeah Buttercup, if there's a hell and we all end up there, it'll be one heck of a party. I hear Soj plays bass and didn't Katz say she sings?

luna

[Jaymes]

-mod note-

If you are not Christian, you MAY NOT post in this thread. This is clearly outlined in the forum rules.

-mod note-

EDIT: Thread temporarily locked to allow for cleanup.

[Fluffy]

Reopened. Once again please respect the other members of the site and only participate in same faith debates if you are of the faith that has been specified. In this thread it is Christian so all non-Christians cannot post.

[adilrockstar]

Originally Posted by Aqualung

Which is an example of juding? Which is an example of "throwing stones"?

1. "Rape is bad."
2. "You are bad, because you raped someone."

Both? Neither? One or the other?

Judging someone is something that you do in your heart.

Throwing stones is a result of judging someone.

Everyone has to realize that we are all unworthy of God's love.

God loves the rapist, just as much as he loves the Preacher.

No amount of good or bad deeds will change God's love for us.

But their is a promise in being forgiving.
The person that forgives much will also be forgiven in the same measure he forgives.

If you want to be forgiven for your wrongs and be able to progress past the implications of those wrongs on your life, you must be willing to forgive others for their wrongs.

By forgiving I mean in your heart you don't hold a grudge or anger. You just give it to God to deal with and trust.


God Bless

[adilrockstar]

Originally Posted by Baerly

Wouldn't you agree that the word of God tells us to warn those in error. I find these verses which tell us to warn certain people they are on their way to hell if they do not repent (Gal.1:6-9) (Luke 13:3) (Luke 17:3,4) (Mt 18:15-17) (Rom.16:17) (2Thess.3:6,14) (1Cor.5:5). So it does matter which way we go. Not only that but the bible tells us that God uses Christians to preach to others and tell them the gospel,this would include the verses above.

God has set the plan of salvation in order (Titus 2:11,12). It is carried out by word of mouth. People telling others the word of God (Acts 11:14). God warns us through the bible how to worship and how to live as a Christian (1Thess.4:1).

I am not picking on you, I just want to make a point.

We are here to share the truth with people.

What we have to watch out for is that we aren't the ones doing the sharing, but the Holy Spirit inside of us.

My point is that many Christians get in the way of God. They use their own words and don't wait on God.

We should be patient and Pray for guidence from God before we speak with those in need.

Just a thought.

God Bless

Adil