Christian: Iron Grip! (Jesus, salvation, eternal, bible, Satan)

[precept]

What does it mean? John 10:28.....".............neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand."?

I call this the "Iron Grip"!


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[Chris]

If you're going to post something like that, you really shouldn't post only half of a sentence. You should at least post the context of the scripture.

[precept]

Originally Posted by Chris

If you're going to post something like that, you really shouldn't post only half of a sentence. You should at least post the context of the scripture.

If I understand correctly the philosophy as perpetrated by those Christians who Cannot be lost once they have proclaimed belief in Jesus as Saviour of mankind....that they can never be lost after so affirming their belief in Jesus...then they are in fact in an Iron Clasp from which they cannot be torn even if they themselves would wish to be free from the IRON GRIP of salvation.

No one can free them from the Iron Grip of salvation...No! not even can they voluntary free themselves if they now wished "salvation" for themselves no more!". They are in its death grasp whether they want to be or not!


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[Chris]

Actually I meant the scripture verse.... You shouldn't just pull half a verse out of the Bible and post it. You should post it in context. Otherwise you can be very misleading.

[Scuba Pete]

Sure he should... we all have Bibles. He want us to focus on one aspect of this verse and that's OK. Here is the verse in situ with the verse inquestion emboldened:

John 10:25 Jesus answered, "I did tell you, but you do not believe. The miracles I do in my Father's name speak for me, 26 but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all ; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. 30 I and the Father are one."

For me it means that only I can seperate me from the love of Christ. No one can pull me away without my active desire and consent.

[Chris]

Sure he should... we all have Bibles. He want us to focus on one aspect of this verse and that's OK. Here is the verse in situ with the verse inquestion emboldened:

That's not the point. I could pull half of any scripture verse out of the Bible and post it, and then argue that God hates every person on the planet and simply has us here for His delight in torturing us.

That's basically the method Satan used to tempt Christ, isn't it?

And this isn't necessarily true at all times. Mostly when the topic is contoversial, as this one is. It' just plain sloppy and irresponsible to lay the question out like that.

[Dadball]

Originally Posted by NetDoc

For me it means that only I can seperate me from the love of Christ. No one can pull me away without my active desire and consent.

AMEN

[precept]

So now the Jury rests: If the sinner who voluntarily places his eternal life in the Loving nail scarred Hands of his Saviour decides to [b]voluntarily remain in His Loving Embrace[b] there he is welcome to remain for ever!....Nothing! No one can take him away; as long as he chooses there to remain.

Like a sheep he has found his Shepherd; and like a sheep once he has found his shepherd; his will his shepherd be for its entire life. There will never be any reason to even think of having another shepherd. The sheep knows that his shepherd will provide for its every need; and so the sheep will "never want". The sheep is eternally secure in the embrace of his shepherd as it eats peacefully on the tableland of succulent green grass while its predator foe is kept at bay by his ever watchful shepherd....The sheep is at peace even in the presence of its enemies. And if and when the sheep strays and slips and is lost as the herd grazes on without missing that one lost sheep. The lost sheep grazes on unmindful that it is lost; but then soon realizes it is lost and calls out for its shepherd. Instinctively the shepherd counts his sheep and discovers one is missing....he quickly gathers his sheep in a protective enclosure and sets out to find his lost sheep. The sheep though lost does not seek another shepherd. It knows just one..and only that shepherd it now seeks. It is soon found, weak and bleeding from wounds derived when it slipped. The shepherd anoints the bruised head of the sheep with oil Oh, with so much oil that the wounds of the sheep are soothingly medicated. For the sheep, his care is so good "its cup runneth over".
The sheep is having it so good...he is not going anywhere...because the sheep knows that his shepherd's "goodness and mercy will follow it" as long as it chooses to remain the sheep of his shepherd. And so the sheep decides to remain and "dwell in the house of his shepherd forever".

Because of the Loving experience enjoyed by every sheep of our Loving Saviour; we can all say "who can separate us from so much love"? Who would want to be separated from so much love? Would any amount of sinful attractions lure us away from so much love? Would any amount of worldly fame lure us away from so much love? Would any "Principality or Power" lure us away from so much love? Would any height of any sort of glory lure us away from so much love? Would any depth of despair make us not want to bask anymore in His Love? Would any present event of any sort or any future event of any sort make us not want to remain anymore in his Loving embrace? OR is there anything, ANYTHING, that we know of that would be more Loving, and more accomodating, and more Forgiving, so much so that we would to transfer our undying affection to another shepherd!

The "Iron Grip" is the grip of the sheep on its shepherd as it refuses to be separated for any reason, from the shepherd who would lovingly forfeit his own life for any single one of his sheep. But only a sheep would want to grip its shepherd so
Lovingly Tight...a goat on the other hand is the one that needs to held in chains or it will voluntarily stray. The sheepour Saviour says He puts on his right hand......the goats our Saviour says He puts on the left. the sheep our Saviour says are the saints of His kingdom-His bride. The goats are fodder for the fires of hell



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