Hebrew Exodus from Egypt?

[Arlanbb]

Has anyone figured out which person was King of Egypt when the Hebrew's left Egypt??

[Cordoba]

According to Dr. Maurice Bucaille in his book titled (The Bible, The Qur'an and Science: Holy Scriptures Examined in the Light of Modern Knowledge), the Pharoah of the Exodus was Merneptah

Dr. Bucaille, who is a French surgeon, visited the Cairo Museum in June 1975, and the Egyptian authorities allowed him to examine the Pharaoh's mummy

For more details:

Qur'anic and Biblical Narrations

This is the Table of Contents of the book:

The Bible, The Qur'an and Science

[S-word]

Originally Posted by Arlanbb

Has anyone figured out which person was King of Egypt when the Hebrew's left Egypt??

It depends on whether you believe Exodus 12: 40; which states that the Israelites who entered Egypt sometime in 1700 B.C., lived there for 430 years to the day, which means you would be looking for a pharaoh who ruled Egypt sometime in 1200/1300 B.C., but if you believe Paul, who in Galatians 3: 17; states that there was a period of 430 years between the time that God made the covenant with Abraham and the time of the Exodus when the law was introduced, then you would need to look for the Pharaoh who was ruling southern Egypt at the time of the expulsion of the Hyksos sometime in 1500 B.C., about the time that the island of Santorini blew its top.

I believe that the so called miraculous events that occurred around the time of the expulsion of the Hyksos/Israelites around 1550 B.C., can be explained by the volcanic island of Santorini or Thira as it is also called, which according to the usual date range from archaeological evidence exploded somewhere between about 1550 and 1500 B.C.

The Island of Santorini is situated in the Aegean Sea on the Anatolian tectonic plate, which is subject to the forces of the over-riding African plate in its northern migration, exploded with ten times the force of Krakatoa, which was a volcanic island that exploded in 1883, and the explosion of Krakatoa was heard some 5000 kilometres away, and caused a tsunami that killed at least 36,000 people.

It has been estimated that when the island of Santorini exploded, 35,000 kilometres of material was blasted into the stratosphere, and the force of that explosion would have created tidal waves of anything up to 130ft high which would have travelled at speeds of up to 150 miles per hour. A cloud that turned day into night around 1500 B.C. has been recorded in Chinese history, and would have covered all of north Africa.

The African and Arabian Plates intersect in a line that runs through the Red Sea and up the Jordan valley through the dead sea which was created when Abraham was 100, some hundreds of years before the explosion of Santorini, when violent volcanic activity destroyed the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, which were then situated in the lush Jordan valley which in the days of Lot was described as like unto the garden of the Lord, with abundant fresh water flowing through it.

Look at the strange phenomenon that was occurring at the time of the expulsion of the Hyksos. The cloud that blanketed all of north Africa and most of Europe, and as said previously, was even recorded in ancient Chinese history, which turned day into night so dark that a man was not able to recognise his brother who was standing at arm’s length from him. The rain of sulphuric acid that caused so much crop failure and loss of livestock that was forced to feed on the polluted pastures. The following shock waves running through the Great Rift Valley, and the fractures in the Sini Peninsular, which is situated on the Arabian Plate and was the cause of the catastrophic event that destroyed the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah when Abraham was just 100.

The bulging of the earth’s crust beneath the Red Sea which caused a highway to rise from the waters, with its following tremors when it collapsed and tidal waves that rolled in like two walls of water on either side of where the highway had been.

From the R.H.Charles translation of the “Wisdom of Solomon” 19: 7-8; Then was beheld the cloud that shadowed the camp and dry land rising up out of what was before water. Out of the Red Sea an unhindered highway and grassy plain rising out of the violent surge.” Look even where the Israelites were camped on the shores of the Red Sea, which was smack bang in the middle of a major coal field in Egypt. The bulging earth rising from the sea before them, pressurised gas screaming from the opening fissures, creating towering pillars of fire behind them, a strong east wind blew all that night, not only helping to dry out the land bridge before them, but causing the thick smoke to blind the pursuing Egyptians while lighting up the camp of the Israelites on the eastern side of those wild fires.

All these events were caused from pressures that had been built up over tens of thousands of years and would have occurred in their proper time irrelevant of the Israeli situation. Where the miracle lay, was in the fact that the Son of Man, who is born of the dying body of mankind in the future, was able to descend along the eternal genetic thread of life that binds the Alpha to the Omega, and that unseen deity was able, through his obedient servant Moses, to organise the event leading up to and including the exodus itself, at the precise time in history that this cataclysmic event occurred.

Solomon has much to say about the days of Moses; he speaks of the strange hails that fell from heaven. Burning balls of differing frozen gases, some with the ability to burn even in water, some which burned with a heat so intense that they incinerated anything they came in contact with. While other hail burned with a cold fire through which animals could walk unharmed.

Solomon also speaks of the cloud that shadowed the Israelites in the desert and of the Manna that fell from heaven during the night. According to Solomon, the heavenly covering was a cloud by day and a host of stars by night. (A night sky ablaze with falling balls of burning hailstones) Then concerning the heavenly Manna, Solomon says, “And that which could not be injured by fire, (The burning hailstones) simply warmed by a faint sunbeam, melted away.

Each morning, the desert floor was covered with a small white flaky cellulose substance which had apparently floated down as the burning hailstones disintegrated above the camp. A substance that they called ‘Manna’ which would melt and breed worms if left out in the sun, and yet could be preserved by cooking. The manna was said to have tasted like coriander seed mixed with olive oil. The early Egyptian scientist or magicians were able to duplicate some of the miracles of God as performed by Moses. Perhaps our scientists of today are better qualified to perform the more mysterious of God’s miracles in the days of Moses.

Carbohydrates are any of a group of chemical compounds, including sugars, starches, and cellulose, containing carbon, hydrogen and oxygen only, with the ratio of hydrogen atoms usually two to one. Carbon, hydrogen and oxygen, would have been in abundant supply up in the stratosphere after the explosion of Thira/Santorini. Perhaps if our scientists could simulate the same conditions that occurred in the stratosphere after the sun had set, for some forty years after the volcanic island had blown its top, they may come up with an inexpensive and environmentally friendly source of food production to feed the starving millions, or even a way for astronauts to produce food from comets when and if travel between the many solar systems in our galaxy ever become feasible.

[Wookiemonster]

I saw that show...intresting premiss...

[Arlanbb]

Originally Posted by Cordoba

According to Dr. Maurice Bucaille in his book titled (The Bible, The Qur'an and Science: Holy Scriptures Examined in the Light of Modern Knowledge), the Pharoah of the Exodus was Merneptah

Dr. Bucaille, who is a French surgeon, visited the Cairo Museum in June 1975, and the Egyptian authorities allowed him to examine the Pharaoh's mummy

For more details:

Qur'anic and Biblical Narrations

This is the Table of Contents of the book:

The Bible, The Qur'an and Science

The main problem with Merenpath being the King of Egypt for the Exodus is that in about 1207BC Merenpath's army had already been winning victories in Syria-Palestine and Merenpath had found that Israel was already living in Canaan in 1207BC, therefore the Exodus had to have been way before 1207BC, at least 40 or more years, which would but it in King Ramses II life time or his father SetiI

[Arlanbb]

Originally Posted by S-word

It depends on whether you believe Exodus 12: 40; which states that the Israelites who entered Egypt sometime in 1700 B.C., lived there for 430 years to the day, which means you would be looking for a pharaoh who ruled Egypt sometime in 1200/1300 B.C., but if you believe Paul, who in Galatians 3: 17; states that there was a period of 430 years between the time that God made the covenant with Abraham and the time of the Exodus when the law was introduced, then you would need to look for the Pharaoh who was ruling southern Egypt at the time of the expulsion of the Hyksos sometime in 1500 B.C., about the time that the island of Santorini blew its top.

I believe that the so called miraculous events that occurred around the time of the expulsion of the Hyksos/Israelites around 1550 B.C., can be explained by the volcanic island of Santorini or Thira as it is also called, which according to the usual date range from archaeological evidence exploded somewhere between about 1550 and 1500 B.C.

The Island of Santorini is situated in the Aegean Sea on the Anatolian tectonic plate, which is subject to the forces of the over-riding African plate in its northern migration, exploded with ten times the force of Krakatoa, which was a volcanic island that exploded in 1883, and the explosion of Krakatoa was heard some 5000 kilometres away, and caused a tsunami that killed at least 36,000 people.

It has been estimated that when the island of Santorini exploded, 35,000 kilometres of material was blasted into the stratosphere, and the force of that explosion would have created tidal waves of anything up to 130ft high which would have travelled at speeds of up to 150 miles per hour. A cloud that turned day into night around 1500 B.C. has been recorded in Chinese history, and would have covered all of north Africa.

The African and Arabian Plates intersect in a line that runs through the Red Sea and up the Jordan valley through the dead sea which was created when Abraham was 100, some hundreds of years before the explosion of Santorini, when violent volcanic activity destroyed the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, which were then situated in the lush Jordan valley which in the days of Lot was described as like unto the garden of the Lord, with abundant fresh water flowing through it.

Look at the strange phenomenon that was occurring at the time of the expulsion of the Hyksos. The cloud that blanketed all of north Africa and most of Europe, and as said previously, was even recorded in ancient Chinese history, which turned day into night so dark that a man was not able to recognise his brother who was standing at arm’s length from him. The rain of sulphuric acid that caused so much crop failure and loss of livestock that was forced to feed on the polluted pastures. The following shock waves running through the Great Rift Valley, and the fractures in the Sini Peninsular, which is situated on the Arabian Plate and was the cause of the catastrophic event that destroyed the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah when Abraham was just 100.

The bulging of the earth’s crust beneath the Red Sea which caused a highway to rise from the waters, with its following tremors when it collapsed and tidal waves that rolled in like two walls of water on either side of where the highway had been.

From the R.H.Charles translation of the “Wisdom of Solomon” 19: 7-8; Then was beheld the cloud that shadowed the camp and dry land rising up out of what was before water. Out of the Red Sea an unhindered highway and grassy plain rising out of the violent surge.” Look even where the Israelites were camped on the shores of the Red Sea, which was smack bang in the middle of a major coal field in Egypt. The bulging earth rising from the sea before them, pressurised gas screaming from the opening fissures, creating towering pillars of fire behind them, a strong east wind blew all that night, not only helping to dry out the land bridge before them, but causing the thick smoke to blind the pursuing Egyptians while lighting up the camp of the Israelites on the eastern side of those wild fires.

All these events were caused from pressures that had been built up over tens of thousands of years and would have occurred in their proper time irrelevant of the Israeli situation. Where the miracle lay, was in the fact that the Son of Man, who is born of the dying body of mankind in the future, was able to descend along the eternal genetic thread of life that binds the Alpha to the Omega, and that unseen deity was able, through his obedient servant Moses, to organise the event leading up to and including the exodus itself, at the precise time in history that this cataclysmic event occurred.

Solomon has much to say about the days of Moses; he speaks of the strange hails that fell from heaven. Burning balls of differing frozen gases, some with the ability to burn even in water, some which burned with a heat so intense that they incinerated anything they came in contact with. While other hail burned with a cold fire through which animals could walk unharmed.

Solomon also speaks of the cloud that shadowed the Israelites in the desert and of the Manna that fell from heaven during the night. According to Solomon, the heavenly covering was a cloud by day and a host of stars by night. (A night sky ablaze with falling balls of burning hailstones) Then concerning the heavenly Manna, Solomon says, “And that which could not be injured by fire, (The burning hailstones) simply warmed by a faint sunbeam, melted away.

Each morning, the desert floor was covered with a small white flaky cellulose substance which had apparently floated down as the burning hailstones disintegrated above the camp. A substance that they called ‘Manna’ which would melt and breed worms if left out in the sun, and yet could be preserved by cooking. The manna was said to have tasted like coriander seed mixed with olive oil. The early Egyptian scientist or magicians were able to duplicate some of the miracles of God as performed by Moses. Perhaps our scientists of today are better qualified to perform the more mysterious of God’s miracles in the days of Moses.

Carbohydrates are any of a group of chemical compounds, including sugars, starches, and cellulose, containing carbon, hydrogen and oxygen only, with the ratio of hydrogen atoms usually two to one. Carbon, hydrogen and oxygen, would have been in abundant supply up in the stratosphere after the explosion of Thira/Santorini. Perhaps if our scientists could simulate the same conditions that occurred in the stratosphere after the sun had set, for some forty years after the volcanic island had blown its top, they may come up with an inexpensive and environmentally friendly source of food production to feed the starving millions, or even a way for astronauts to produce food from comets when and if travel between the many solar systems in our galaxy ever become feasible.

The Exodus Decoded movie has a lot of flaws in it S-word.
1. It claims that the Hyksas were the Israelites which all archaeologists knows is not true.
2. It claims the eruption of the island of Thira was in 1500 BC when all C-14 testing shows it happened over 100 years before. Go to the www.therafoundation.org.
3. Manna is a secreation from a plant that grows in the desert and today it is an export that is shipped all over the world and it has a tast of the coriander seed mixed with olive oil.
Looks like you have been taken hook line and sinker by the fake movie, S-word.

[Humanistheart]

Originally Posted by Arlanbb

Has anyone figured out which person was King of Egypt when the Hebrew's left Egypt??

I'm not sure there's a biblical commentary on it. If there was I imagine someone would have posted it by now. And speaking historically the hebrew people were never enslaved in egypt so nothing in exodus is actually true.

[Arlanbb]

Originally Posted by Humanistheart

I'm not sure there's a biblical commentary on it. If there was I imagine someone would have posted it by now. And speaking historically the hebrew people were never enslaved in egypt so nothing in exodus is actually true.

Humanistheart ~ I agree with you but I thought it might make a interesting question to see what might come out of the woodwork if you give them something to chew on.
Strickly speaking, there has never been any clear evidence discovered in Egypt, or elsewhere, to support a million or so Israelite Exodus from Egypt.

[S-word]

Originally Posted by Arlanbb

The Exodus Decoded movie has a lot of flaws in it S-word.
1. It claims that the Hyksas were the Israelites which all archaeologists knows is not true.
2. It claims the eruption of the island of Thira was in 1500 BC when all C-14 testing shows it happened over 100 years before. Go to the www.therafoundation.org.
3. Manna is a secreation from a plant that grows in the desert and today it is an export that is shipped all over the world and it has a tast of the coriander seed mixed with olive oil.
Looks like you have been taken hook line and sinker by the fake movie, S-word.

Quote Arlanbb: The Exodus Decoded movie has a lot of flaws in it S-word.
By S-word: And who mentioned anything about the Exodus Decoded Movie? Certainly not I.

Quote Arlanbb: 1. It claims that the Hyksas were the Israelites which all archaeologists knows is not true.

By S-word: As I have never seen the movie, I will have to take your word for that, but nevertheless that will be shown to be the truth. Knowing from Galatians 3:17; that there was a period of 430 years from the day that God made his covenant with Abraham and the time that the law was given through Moses, and that Isaac, who was born 15 years after the covenant, was 60 when Jacob was born and that Jacob was 130 when he was reunited with his son Joseph in Egypt, which means that 205 years had elapsed from the covenant and left only 225 years that the Israelites sojourned in that land.

And it is written that Joseph who entered Egypt in 1700 B.C. about the same time as the Hyksos, made slaves of all the Egyptians from one end of the land to the other without striking a blow, and It’s said also in the Encyclopaedia Encarta, that the Egyptian Middle Kingdom period ended with invasion. In the early part of the seventeenth century B.C. (the time when Joseph entered Egypt) Semetic invaders (Descendants of Shem) called Hyksos, swept into Egypt and they would control Egypt for roughly 2 centuries...... 225 years is the time that Israel sojourned in Egypt and could be defined as roughly 2 centuries.

Jacquetta hawkes, in “The World of the Past” (1963,p.444) states: “It is no longer thought that the Hyksos rulers..represent the invasion of a conquering horde of Asiatics; they were wandering groups of Semites, who had come to Egypt for trade and other peaceful purposes.”


Then again, it’s stated in the Encarta Encyclopaedia that at the end of the Middle Kingdom period, the establishment of a Hyksos dynasty in northern Egypt marked the second intermediate period, a time of turmoil and disunity that lasted for more than 214 years. The 225 years that Israel were in Egypt is a little more than 214 years, but what’s a year or two here and there?

Quote Arlanbb: 2. It claims the eruption of the island of Thira was in 1500 BC when all C-14 testing shows it happened over 100 years before. Go to the www.therafoundation.org.

By S-word: The Exact date of the eruption of Santorini is unknown and although Radiocarbon dating indicates that the eruption occurred about 1645-1600 B.C., these dates conflict with the usual date range from archaeological evidence, which puts the eruption somewhere between 1550 and 1500 B.C.
Professor Norman Hammond of Rutgers University claimed that the Radiocarbon dates require radical changes. Many geologists agree that Thera/Santorini exploded around 1520-1500 B.C. Radiocarbon dating is not as reliable as you would have your readers believe; here are just a few examples of abnormal results from carbon dating which gave the age of the death of a freshly killed seal at McMurdo Sound, Antarctica at 1300 years ago.
Here’s another: A petrified miner’s hat and wooden fence posts which were unearthed from an abandoned nineteenth century town in outback Australia were said to be 6000 years old according to carbon dating. There were also recently harvested, live mollusc shells from the Hawaiian coast which were shown to have died 2000 years ago and snail shells just killed in Nevada, USA, dated as having died 1300 years ago; so much for the reliability of C14 dating.

Quote Arlanbb: 3. Manna is a secreation from a plant that grows in the desert and today it is an export that is shipped all over the world and it has a tast of the coriander seed mixed with olive oil.

By S-word: That which is today called manna and cultivated commercially, comes from the manna ash tree (Fraxinns ornus) which is grown in plantations around Palermo, Sicily and should not be confused with the Tamarisk Manna that grows scantily in salt desert areas and which is erroneously thought by some to be the source of the Biblical manna that fell from the heavens every week for 40 years.

Although the Tamarisk could have been more plentiful in the days of Exodus, there is absolutely no way that it could have produced the amount needed by the Israelite to supplement their daily diet and besides that, it exudes what we today call manna, only at a certain season while the Biblical manna fell all year round. The Tamarisk manna appears only in May and June, and in some years not at all, whereas the heavenly manna fell all year round and was able to feed the wandering nation of Israel for forty years; plus the manna from heaven could be baked, the material secreated from the Tamerisk cannot be.

And forget about what you might read and have not researched and verified it, even if it is something that was written by myself whose hands sometimes move across the keyboard faster that my mind can keep track of what they are typing; for the Manna did not taste as you have copied without checking if it was correct, like coriander seed mixed with olive oil, but it looked like small white coriander seed and tasted like wafers made with honey, see for yourself Exodus 16: 31.

Quote Arlanbb: Looks like you have been taken hook line and sinker by the fake movie, S-word.

By S-word: Looks like you’ve still got a lot of growing up to do Arlanbb.

[Arlanbb]

Originally Posted by S-word

Quote Arlanbb: The Exodus Decoded movie has a lot of flaws in it S-word.
By S-word: And who mentioned anything about the Exodus Decoded Movie? Certainly not I. Your right you didn't mention the movie........................................

Quote Arlanbb: 1. It claims that the Hyksas were the Israelites which all archaeologists knows is not true.

By S-word: As I have never seen the movie, I will have to take your word for that, but nevertheless that will be shown to be the truth. Knowing from Galatians 3:17; that there was a period of 430 years from the day that God made his covenant with Abraham and the time that the law was given through Moses, and that Isaac, who was born 15 years after the covenant, was 60 when Jacob was born and that Jacob was 130 when he was reunited with his son Joseph in Egypt, which means that 205 years had elapsed from the covenant and left only 225 years that the Israelites sojourned in that land.

And it is written that Joseph who entered Egypt in 1700 B.C. about the same time as the Hyksos, made slaves of all the Egyptians from one end of the land to the other without striking a blow, and It’s said also in the Encyclopaedia Encarta, that the Egyptian Middle Kingdom period ended with invasion. In the early part of the seventeenth century B.C. (the time when Joseph entered Egypt) Semetic invaders (Descendants of Shem) called Hyksos, swept into Egypt and they would control Egypt for roughly 2 centuries...... 225 years is the time that Israel sojourned in Egypt and could be defined as roughly 2 centuries.
From Arlanbb ~You say "it is written that Joseph..entered Egypt in 1700 BC" Please tell me where it is written that Joseph entered Egypt in 1700 BC??? According to David P Silverman, curator-in-charge of the Egyptian section of the Univ. of Pennsylvania Museum, in his book "Ancient Egypt" states that All of Egypt was only completely under Hyksos control during the 15 Dynasty or from about 1630 to 1523 BC which is only 107 years not 200 years as you say. Only the 15 Dynasty is know as the "Hyksos Dynasty". King Ahmose of the Dynasty 18 [1539-1514 BC] drove out the Hyksos.
According to Silverman The middle Kingdoms of Egypt was Dynasties 11, 12 and 13 which lasted from about 1981 to 1630 BC.
You need to get your Dynasties right S-word to understand what really went on back then.

Jacquetta hawkes, in “The World of the Past” (1963,p.444) states: “It is no longer thought that the Hyksos rulers..represent the invasion of a conquering horde of Asiatics; they were wandering groups of Semites, who had come to Egypt for trade and other peaceful purposes.”


Then again, it’s stated in the Encarta Encyclopaedia that at the end of the Middle Kingdom period, the establishment of a Hyksos dynasty in northern Egypt marked the second intermediate period, a time of turmoil and disunity that lasted for more than 214 years. The 225 years that Israel were in Egypt is a little more than 214 years, but what’s a year or two here and there?

Quote Arlanbb: 2. It claims the eruption of the island of Thira was in 1500 BC when all C-14 testing shows it happened over 100 years before. Go to the www.therafoundation.org.

By S-word: The Exact date of the eruption of Santorini is unknown and although Radiocarbon dating indicates that the eruption occurred about 1645-1600 B.C., these dates conflict with the usual date range from archaeological evidence, which puts the eruption somewhere between 1550 and 1500 B.C.
Professor Norman Hammond of Rutgers University claimed that the Radiocarbon dates require radical changes. Many geologists agree that Thera/Santorini exploded around 1520-1500 B.C. Radiocarbon dating is not as reliable as you would have your readers believe; here are just a few examples of abnormal results from carbon dating which gave the age of the death of a freshly killed seal at McMurdo Sound, Antarctica at 1300 years ago. Looks like you forgot to go to www.therafoundation.org. because they say you are wrong............
Here’s another: A petrified miner’s hat and wooden fence posts which were unearthed from an abandoned nineteenth century town in outback Australia were said to be 6000 years old according to carbon dating. There were also recently harvested, live mollusc shells from the Hawaiian coast which were shown to have died 2000 years ago and snail shells just killed in Nevada, USA, dated as having died 1300 years ago; so much for the reliability of C14 dating. You give no references to these so called C-14 bad datas so till you do and I can look them up they really have no mean at all. C-14 has been crossed dated with tree-rings and proven to be within 8% back to 6000 years.

Quote Arlanbb: 3. Manna is a secreation from a plant that grows in the desert and today it is an export that is shipped all over the world and it has a tast of the coriander seed mixed with olive oil.

By S-word: That which is today called manna and cultivated commercially, comes from the manna ash tree (Fraxinns ornus) which is grown in plantations around Palermo, Sicily and should not be confused with the Tamarisk Manna that grows scantily in salt desert areas and which is erroneously thought by some to be the source of the Biblical manna that fell from the heavens every week for 40 years.

Although the Tamarisk could have been more plentiful in the days of Exodus, there is absolutely no way that it could have produced the amount needed by the Israelite to supplement their daily diet and besides that, it exudes what we today call manna, only at a certain season while the Biblical manna fell all year round. The Tamarisk manna appears only in May and June, and in some years not at all, whereas the heavenly manna fell all year round and was able to feed the wandering nation of Israel for forty years; plus the manna from heaven could be baked, the material secreated from the Tamerisk cannot be.

And forget about what you might read and have not researched and verified it, even if it is something that was written by myself whose hands sometimes move across the keyboard faster that my mind can keep track of what they are typing; for the Manna did not taste as you have copied without checking if it was correct, like coriander seed mixed with olive oil, but it looked like small white coriander seed and tasted like wafers made with honey, see for yourself Exodus 16: 31.

Quote Arlanbb: Looks like you have been taken hook line and sinker by the fake movie, S-word.

By S-word: Looks like you’ve still got a lot of growing up to do Arlanbb.

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