Book of Mormon a copycat of the Holy Bible? (Jesus Christ, reject)

[Fish-Hunter]

This thread is a personal obeservation from a post of Madhatter. He quoted the Book of Mormon and it reminded me of two verses in the Bible. If you compare the verses from the Book of Mormon with the Holy Bible, it appears that the Book of Mormon is trying to change the central biblical truth of the gospel of grace. Please look for yourself and decide.

Quote: Madhatter
2nd Nephi 25: - Book of Mormon

23 For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.

Mormon 9: - The Book of Mormon

27 O then despise not, and wonder not, but hearken unto the words of the Lord, and ask the Father in the name of Jesus for what things soever ye shall stand in need. Doubt not, but be believing, and begin as in times of old, and come unto the Lord with all your heart, and work out your own salvation with fear and trembling before him.
__________________

Please compare the Book of Mormon above and the Holy Bible below. The Book of Mormon tries to change the central truth of the Holy Bible by copying bible verses with intentional significant changes.

Ephesians 2:8-9: - Holy Bible - Apostle Paul

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. - NIV

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. - KJV

For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. - NASB

Philippians 2:12-13: Holy Bible - Apostle Paul

Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose - NIV

Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. - KJV

[*Paul*]

I find it all a bit confusing to be truthful, I think I have read the majority of it now, in this p[assage you seem to have people saved by faith:

2 And they had aviewed themselves in their own bcarnal state, even cless than the dust of the earth. And they all cried aloud with one voice, saying: O have mercy, and apply the datoning blood of Christ that we may receive forgiveness of our sins, and our hearts may be epurified; for we believe in Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who fcreated heaven and earth, and all things; who shall come down among the children of men.


3 And it came to pass that after they had spoken these words the Spirit of the Lord came upon them, and they were filled with joy, having received a aremission of their sins, and having peace of bconscience, because of the exceeding cfaith which they had in Jesus Christ who should come, according to the dwords which king Benjamin had spoken unto them.

Verse 3 says they received remission of sins because of their faith in the (yet to come) Christ. Yet this salvation has to be kept by them (like in Catholicism):

6 I say unto you, if ye have come to a aknowledge of the goodness of God, and his matchless power, and his wisdom, and his patience, and his long-suffering towards the children of men; and also, the batonement which has been prepared from the cfoundation of the world, that thereby salvation might come to him that should put his dtrust in the Lord, and should be diligent in keeping his commandments, and continue in the faith even unto the end of his life, I mean the life of the mortal body—
7 I say, that this is the man who receiveth salvation, through the atonement which was prepared from the foundation of the world for all mankind, which ever were since the afall of Adam, or who are, or who ever shall be, even unto the end of the world. 8 And this is the means whereby salvation cometh. And there is anone other salvation save this which hath been spoken of; neither are there any conditions whereby man can be saved except the conditions which I have told you.

9 Believe in aGod; believe that he is, and that he bcreated all things, both in heaven and in earth; believe that he has all cwisdom, and all power, both in heaven and in earth; believe that man doth not dcomprehend all the things which the Lord can comprehend.

10 And again, believe that ye must arepent of your sins and forsake them, and humble yourselves before God; and ask in bsincerity of heart that he would cforgive you; and now, if you dbelieve all these things see that ye edo them.

Just out of interest what is this never ending torment mentioned:

5 And we are willing to enter into a acovenant with our God to do his will, and to be obedient to his commandments in all things that he shall command us, all the remainder of our days, that we may not bring upon ourselves a bnever-ending torment, as has been spoken by the cangel, that we may not drink out of the cup of the wrath of God

[lilithu]

From those verses, the Book of Mormon makes more sense than than your interpretation of the Apostle Paul. I always wonder why so-called Christians spend more time quoting Paul than they do Christ.


Edit:
Paul was trying to argue against arrogance/vanity. He was saying that we are saved by God's grace, not our efforts, so that we don't get too full of ourselves. He was NOT saying to be against works.

Then certain folks go and turn that into, "You're saved by grace; therefore you don't have to do anything. Just sit back and be smug about how you believe the right thing due to God choosing you over others, and argue with anyone who says that works are important too. Because after all, that would suggest that you actually have to express your faith in action as opposed to denigrating others.

[texan1]

Originally Posted by lilithu

From those verses, the Book of Mormon makes more sense than than your interpretation of the Apostle Paul. I always wonder why so-called Christians spend more time quoting Paul than they do Christ.


Edit:
Paul was trying to argue against arrogance/vanity. He was saying that we are saved by God's grace, not our efforts, so that we don't get too full of ourselves. He was NOT saying to be against works.

Then certain folks go and turn that into, "You're saved by grace; therefore you don't have to do anything. Just sit back and be smug about how you believe the right thing due to God choosing you over others, and argue with anyone who says that works are important too. Because after all, that would suggest that you actually have to express your faith in action as opposed to denigrating others.

I agree with this completely. I must admit that I am no longer a theist, but this was always a big pet peeve of mine. There are some Christians who translate the verse this way and I think it sends the wrong message. This type of thinking devalues good works in my opinion. It seems like a person's actions and good works are just as important (if not more important) than their beliefs. I admire the Mormons and anyone else, religious or not, who spend their life doing good works as opposed to simply sitting around "believing in the right things".

[Scott1]

Originally Posted by Fish-Hunter

Book of Mormon a copycat of the Holy Bible?

Just want to add my humble opinion that I could care less if it is or not.... and I think some people would be better served reading their own scripture and shutting the frak up.

[Fish-Hunter]

It is quite amazing and consistent with the Word of God that a non-thesis, Universalist, Shamanic Panentheist, and a Roman Catholic would rally to the LDS gospel of works to be justified before God. It is also quite clear that those who reject justification by the person and works of Christ alone through the instrument of faith alone are consistently hostile of the writings of Paul and the Holy Bible. The gospel of God's sufficient and complete grace is extremely hostile to the flesh, due to the pride of man and enmity to God. This was the battle in the first century with the proclamation of the gospel of God's grace. This is the same battle today too. The message of the cross is an offense to mankind, and foolishness to those who are perishing according to the Holy Bible alone. Biblical Christianity and the gospel of God's grace humbles mankind and leaves no room to boast before God and man. At least the Universalist, non-thesis, Shamanic Panentheist, and Roman Catholic appear to confirm that the Book of Mormon and the writings of Paul have two mutually exclusive gospels and messages to mankind. I am not telling anyone how to believe, but I am establishing that the Holy Bible has a different gospel than the gospel found in the Book of Mormon.

Christ the Wisdom and Power of God

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. For it is written:
"I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate."
Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. For the foolishness of God is wiser than man's wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than man's strength.
Brothers, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things—and the things that are not—to nullify the things that are, so that no one may boast before him. It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God—that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. Therefore, as it is written: "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord." 1 Cor 1 - Holy Bible

Here are additional writings of the Apostle of Paul that are contrary to the Book of Mormon's gospel. Pau's gospel of grace is never seeker friendly to those outside the biblical Christian faith. Why do you think Paul was stoned, beaten, and was threaten with death all through his life as an Apostle of Christ? The Book of Mormon appears to take away the offense of the cross, allowing boasting of the flesh in before God and man.

1. Acts 20:24 (Whole Chapter)
   However, I consider my life worth nothing to me, if only I may finish the race and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me—the task of testifying to the gospel of God's grace.
2. Ephesians 3:7 (Whole Chapter)
   I became a servant of this gospel by the gift of God's grace given me through the working of his power.
3. Philippians 1:7 (Whole Chapter)
   It is right for me to feel this way about all of you, since I have you in my heart; for whether I am in chains or defending and confirming the gospel, all of you share in God's grace with me.
4. Colossians 1:6 (Whole Chapter)
   that has come to you. All over the world this gospel is bearing fruit and growing, just as it has been doing among you since the day you heard it and understood God's grace in all its truth.

[Troublemane]

....Eh? So is this an open debate, or just a "lets attack LDS" and anyone who defends em? Perhaps it would make a more interesting debate if you actually had points to make, FH, instead of just name-calling.

[Fish-Hunter]

Originally Posted by Scott1

Just want to add my humble opinion that I could care less if it is or not.... and I think some people would be better served reading their own scripture and shutting the frak up.

Quick question to add perspective to the issue. Does the Roman Catholic Magestrium (Pope and bishops in communion with him) consider Mormons to be their Christian brothers and sisters in Christ? I'm not looking for your personal opinion, but I asking for the official Roman Catholic position in regards to Mormons as being Christians or not (united to Christ). If the Roman Catholic Magestrium does not consider Mormons to be your brothers and sisters in Christ, why would you personally "care less" if the gospel found in the Book of Mormon is different that the gospel found in the Bible? That can be interpreted as an anti-Christian perspective. Do you reject the following verses as a Christian?

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. - John 14:6

No Other Gospel

I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned! Am I now trying to win the approval of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ. - Galatians 1