Elohim - God or Extraterrestrial Creators? (Jesus, ritual, testimony, Moses)

[Tau]

Shhh don't talk about the lords and ladies, they will only come and find you.

[Dirty Penguin]

Originally Posted by danaustin77

gnostic:

I've found the chapter on Ezekiel it is on page 460 in my Bible and is Chapter/Verse 1:1-3;27; 'As I looked, I saw a great storm coming toward me from the north, driving before it a huge cloud that flashed with lightning and shone with brilliant light ... '

I hope you are able to find it ok, if you don't here's a quick summerary of the experience which is described as a 'vision'.

1:1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth [month], in the fifth [day] of the month, as I [was] among the captives by the river of Chebar, [that] the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God.

1:2 In the fifth [day] of the month, which [was] the fifth year of king Jehoiachin's captivity,
1:3 The word of the LORD came expressly unto Ezekiel the priest, the son of Buzi, in the land of the Chaldeans by the river Chebar; and the hand of the LORD was there upon him.
1:4 And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself, and a brightness [was] about it, and out of the midst thereof as the colour of amber, out of the midst of the fire.
1:5 Also out of the midst thereof [came] the likeness of four living creatures. And this [was] their appearance; they had the likeness of a man.
1:6 And every one had four faces, and every one had four wings.
1:7 And their feet [were] straight feet; and the sole of their feet [was] like the sole of a calf's foot: and they sparkled like the colour of burnished brass.
1:8 And [they had] the hands of a man under their wings on their four sides; and they four had their faces and their wings.
1:9 Their wings [were] joined one to another; they turned not when they went; they went every one straight forward.
1:10 As for the likeness of their faces, they four had the face of a man, and the face of a lion, on the right side: and they four had the face of an ox on the left side; they four also had the face of an eagle.
1:11 Thus [were] their faces: and their wings [were] stretched upward; two [wings] of every one [were] joined one to another, and two covered their bodies.
1:12 And they went every one straight forward: whither the spirit was to go, they went; [and] they turned not when they went.
1:13 As for the likeness of the living creatures, their appearance [was] like burning coals of fire, [and] like the appearance of lamps: it went up and down among the living creatures; and the fire was bright, and out of the fire went forth lightning.
Interesting stuff eh, if that happened today it would certainly be understood differently. BTW I'm sorry to have gone on about alien abductions to you, that was a mistake on my part - its just as soon as I hear the words abduction and alien it worries me.

Thanks again gnostic, and if you want to post anything you want to convey in your own opinion about Ezekiel or the Elohim, then I'd be interested in hearing it!

I've kind of been doing most of the talking on this forum so far, which I didn't mean to, it would be good if someone else could take over, and I certainly only meant to gently persuade 'is any of this true?' rather than conveying 'surely it is true' which is another mistake on my part, but I hope any of you reading have found this thread interesting.

So, is any of Ezekiel's experiences possibly real, and something which many witnessess also experience today and are called contactees, are these people experienceing the same thing? If Ezekiel was on drugs in the experience, why would he go onto preach to many peoples in Isreal etc about the coming of the Lord? Did he not know he had been on drugs, and being righteous about a vision on drugs isn't exactly divine.

Check these out as well


Exodus
13:21 And The Lord went before them by day in a pillar of a cloud, to lead them the way; and by night in a pillar of fire, to give them light; to go by day and night:

13:22 He took not away the pillar of the cloud by day, nor the pillar of fire by night, from before the people

14:19 And the angel of God, which went before the camp of Israel, removed and went behind them; and the pillar of the cloud went from before their face, and stood behind them:

14:20 And it came between the camp of the Egyptians and the camp of Israel; and it was a cloud and darkness to them, but it gave light by night to these: so that the one came not near the other all the night.

19:18 And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the LORD descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.

Sounds like a spaceship to me. I guess this is where Close Encounters Of The Third
Kind of got its story.....

24:18 And Moses went into the midst of the cloud, and gat him up into the mount: and Moses was in the mount forty days and forty nights.


Numbers
10:12 And the children of Israel took their journeys out of the wilderness of Sinai; and the cloud rested in the wilderness of Paran.

2 Kings
2:11 And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.


Genesis

2:21 And The Lord God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;

2:22 And the rib, which The Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

Ahhhhhh......nothing like a little organ harvesting and gene manipulation. Sounds like a medical procedure to me.

28:12 And he dreamed, and behold a ladder set up on the earth, and the top of it reached to heaven: and behold the angels of God ascending and descending on it.

[gnostic]

Originally Posted by danaustin77

Interesting stuff eh, if that happened today it would certainly be understood differently. BTW I'm sorry to have gone on about alien abductions to you, that was a mistake on my part - its just as soon as I hear the words abduction and alien it worries me.

Thanks, danaustin.

Though there's lots of fire in the chapter that you've quoted, this one has nothing about chariot and wheel.

Originally Posted by danaustin77, from post #1

If something divine was happening in ancient times, then surely something divine might concievably be happening today, and not the personal enlightenments of individuals, but actual encounters with 'God' such as Ezekiels experience of a firey charriot.

There's a lot about angels and wings too. Are you sure you have the right quote?

[danaustin77]

Originally Posted by Dirty Penguin

... 19:18 And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the LORD descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly.

Sounds like a spaceship to me. I guess this is where Close Encounters Of The Third
Kind of got its story.....

2:22 And the rib, which The Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

Ahhhhhh......nothing like a little organ harvesting and gene manipulation. Sounds like a medical procedure to me.

Hi Dirty Penguin,

thank you for joining in the discussion, it is a pleasure to have you with us.

Very interesting quotes you have there, I haven't read extensively into the various experiences of 'God' in the Bible, but I imagine there are many, and certainly most of them include very physical events such as clouds and lightning or thunder and a dramatic entrance, which I would imagine a one true God of the universe would surely not need, rather a pyhsical craft on the other hand would have no way of avoiding; a landing being accompanied by fire etc.

Also, you're very right about a medical approach by the so called 'God' of the Old Testament; if there was a divine God of the universe, surely he could wave his ephemeral arm and bring into existence anything he wanted, including a female, rather than going into the phyisical aspects of a medical operation.
I don't like to see life as an 'alien experiment' I think it is much more purposeful than that, and life as something directed, spiritual and has a direction as is supported by the ten commandments, doctrines and the New Testament, rather than a 'lets see what happens if we create humans' theory.

Thank you.

Originally Posted by gnostic

Thanks, danaustin.

Though there's lots of fire in the chapter that you've quoted, this one has nothing about chariot and wheel.

There's a lot about angels and wings too. Are you sure you have the right quote?

Hi gnostic,

sorry, Religious Forum wouldn't let me put in the whole text, and I accidentally left out the part about wheels. My apologies, it was the wheels quotation you wanted from the Bible.

Here it is, I'm quoting from the Bible here;

"As I looked at these beings, I saw four wheels on the ground beneath them, one wheel belonging to each. The wheels sparkled as if made of Chrysolite. All four wheels looked the same; each wheel had a second wheel turning crosswise within it. The beings could move forward in any of the four directions they faced, without turning they moved. the rims of the four wheels were awesomely tall, and they were covered with eyes all around the edges. When the four living beings moved, the wheels moved with them. When they flew upward, the wheels went up, too. The spirit of the four living beings was in the wheels. So wheerever the spirit went, the wheels and the living beings went, too. when the livin beings moved, the wheels moved. When living beings stopped, the wheels stopped. When the living beings flew into the air, the wheels rose up. For the spirit of the living beings was in teh wheels."

Erich Von Daniken postulated that this description concerned a robotic like machine, implying that when the wheels moved one way, the 'beings' moved the same way.

Hope you find this interesting gnostic.

Thank you.

[gnostic]

It is strange that angels that appeared in Genesis, like with Abraham, Lot and Jacob, appeared in human shapes, no wings and no faces of animals, but in Ezekiel's time, which is during Exile period, they began appearing in non-human or semi-human forms.

Sumerian-Babylonian gods and Persian angels appeared in what later Judaic adopted for their angels, suggested that these Israelites are mixing pagan belief with their own. In Egyptian myths, you would see deities with heads of hawk/falcon, lions, serpent, cow/bull, etc. Some of their gods also had wings too.

[danaustin77]

I think is it certainly possible that these 'Angels' were labels people gave to the beings that they came into contact with, also understanding visitations as 'God' or 'Gods', hence a lot of labels, which continue to this day with 'visitors', 'Ets' and 'aliens'?

What does anyone think of this short movie here? Indeed, the question arises why Ets haven't been plastered all over the evening news decades ago, and also why Whistleblowers have come forward, surely if there was nothing to the Et hypothesis, then you wouldn't have hundreds of reliable ex officials coming forward now their secrecy oaths have passed?

Zeitgeist - The Movie

Maybe, just maybe, the economic and power base situation is the reason why there has been a cover up?

[Dirty Penguin]

Originally Posted by gnostic

It is strange that angels that appeared in Genesis, like with Abraham, Lot and Jacob, appeared in human shapes, no wings and no faces of animals, but in Ezekiel's time, which is during Exile period, they began appearing in non-human or semi-human forms.

Sumerian-Babylonian gods and Persian angels appeared in what later Judaic adopted for their angels, suggested that these Israelites are mixing pagan belief with their own. In Egyptian myths, you would see deities with heads of hawk/falcon, lions, serpent, cow/bull, etc. Some of their gods also had wings too.

I have been saying this as well. It is interesting. I believe this is where a lot of the stories of the bible come from. I believe they stem from the sumerian record but over time the stories were told and re-told and some names and suttle events changed as the oral stories became written ones.

These kind of stories may have reappeared in the book of revelation as well. The descriptions of beings and creatures could possibly be the description of interstellar creatures. I know this is complete speculation on my part but to ne it is an interesting concept.

[waikru]

With a pen and a little imagination, anyone can make any conspiracy credible.