Did Jesus say he was God??? (moral, Earth, Messiah, virgin)

[Jeremy Mason]

Originally Posted by logician

The trinity and the cross seem to be too convenient symbols.

I guess you would see it that way.

[Dirty Penguin]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Mason

The Great Commission

16Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. 17When they saw him, they worshiped him; but some doubted. 18Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in[a] the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

Notice they worshiped him and he didn't stop them.

Well this really had nothing to do with Matthew 28:19 (IMO).....

But you seem to focus on "worship" as if they did it because he was a god. This is far from the truth. Worship, if you look it up, meant that they paid him homage, respect, acknowledgement. Yeshua was not the only one "worshiped" in the scripture. So since he wasn't the only one...are they gods too?

Psalm 45:11
So shall the king greatly desire thy beauty: for he is thy Master; and worship thou
him.

Or even the word "pray"....which meant to beg. Not how we interpret it today.

But all of this trying to make Yeshua into God does little in light of Revelation 3:12...Where Yeshua, after the supposed ascension to heaven......He reveals to John he has a god.

Revelation 3:12
All who are victorious will become pillars in the Temple of my God, and they will never have to leave it. And I will write my God's name on them, and they will be citizens in the city of my God--the new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven from my God. And they will have my new name inscribed upon them.

These are explicit staments that need no interpretation. Up to this point God is sitting on the throne receiving praise from his creation but then enters the "lamb" who is the one worthy of opening the seals.

But notice he said the same thing when on earth....."my god"..."your god"......

[Jeremy Mason]

Originally Posted by Dirty Penguin

Well this really had nothing to do with Matthew 28:19 (IMO).....

But you seem to focus on "worship" as if they did it because he was a god. This is far from the truth. Worship, if you look it up, meant that they paid him homage, respect, acknowledgement. Yeshua was not the only one "worshiped" in the scripture. So since he wasn't the only one...are they gods too?

Psalm 45:11
So shall the king greatly desire thy beauty: for he is thy Master; and worship thou
him.

Or even the word "pray"....which meant to beg. Not how we interpret it today.

But all of this trying to make Yeshua into God does little in light of Revelation 3:12...Where Yeshua, after the supposed ascension to heaven......He reveals to John he has a god.

Revelation 3:12
All who are victorious will become pillars in the Temple of my God, and they will never have to leave it. And I will write my God's name on them, and they will be citizens in the city of my God--the new Jerusalem that comes down from heaven from my God. And they will have my new name inscribed upon them.

These are explicit staments that need no interpretation. Up to this point God is sitting on the throne receiving praise from his creation but then enters the "lamb" who is the one worthy of opening the seals.

But notice he said the same thing when on earth....."my god"..."your god"......

What happened when people started worshipping Paul? What did Paul say or do?

[Dirty Penguin]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Mason

What happened when people started worshipping Paul? What did Paul say or do?

Again, this is not the point and it's off topic. "Worship", like the word "Pray"...in those days carried multiple meanings.

Unless you have a way to get around Rev. 3:12 we can only conclude, by the evidence, Yeshua is not God.......

[Jeremy Mason]

Originally Posted by Dirty Penguin

Again, this is not the point and it's off topic. "Worship", like the word "Pray"...in those days carried multiple meanings.

Yes, that's very convenient of you to dodge my question, however Paul was very savvy to the meaning of worship and immediately told them to stop; Jesus was worship a few times because those people realized the significance of Jesus's deity.

Unless you have a way to get around Rev. 3:12 we can only conclude, by the evidence, Yeshua is not God.......

I've told you time and time again that just because Jesus refers the Father as his God does not denounce Jesus as God heir. The only thing that inherits the Kingdom of Heaven is the Father's Son and his chosen ones.

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Mason

Yes, that's very convenient of you to dodge my question, however Paul was very savvy to the meaning of worship and immediately told them to stop; Jesus was worship a few times because those people realized the significance of Jesus's deity.


I've told you time and time again that just because Jesus refers the Father as his God does not denounce Jesus as God heir. The only thing that inherits the Kingdom of Heaven is the Father's Son and his chosen ones.

People in Palestine 'worshipped' Pilate and Herod, too in the same sense. They prayed for favors.

Regards,
Scott

[Jeremy Mason]

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

People in Palestine 'worshipped' Pilate and Herod, too in the same sense. They prayed for favors.

Regards,
Scott

How do you feel God felt about that?

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Mason

How do you feel God felt about that?

In the sense that people 'wroshipped' charismatic leaders asking for favor, I doubt that God worried about it. Best as I can tell "Childishness" is not one of the attributesw of God.

Now in worship as you and I mean it today, I think only God is worthy of worship; but then Jesus never claimed to b e God.

Regards,

Scott