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  #21  
Old 08-07-2007, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Kcnorwood View Post
I'm not sure that burning in the lake of fire counts as reigning.
I am wondering over all time who has won more souls, God or the Devil?

God is jealous, revengeful and demanding. He is also forgiving, loving and caring.

It is all so clear to me. You have to have the perfect balance to be all powerful.

Could it be that Satan saw these faults and took issue with it? Satan was also jealous of God, revengeful by taking 1/3 of the angels with him and also demanding.

I would hazard a guess that he has a good side as well. Music is to his credit for one thing.

Our existence here on earth is but one big social experiment where eternal life is the prize and eternal damnation behind the other door. You can choose the pleasures of this short life over eternal pleasures later. I would say that God is patient while the Devil is into imediate gratification.
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  #22  
Old 08-08-2007, 12:01 AM
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nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
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I still don't see how Satan is a sacrifice. Doesn't being a sacrifice mean doing something for the benefit of others? Satan was only trying to benefit himself.
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  #23  
Old 08-08-2007, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Reverend Rick View Post
I am wondering over all time who has won more souls, God or the Devil?

God is jealous, revengeful and demanding. He is also forgiving, loving and caring.

It is all so clear to me. You have to have the perfect balance to be all powerful.

Could it be that Satan saw these faults and took issue with it? Satan was also jealous of God, revengeful by taking 1/3 of the angels with him and also demanding.

I would hazard a guess that he has a good side as well. Music is to his credit for one thing.

Our existence here on earth is but one big social experiment where eternal life is the prize and eternal damnation behind the other door. You can choose the pleasures of this short life over eternal pleasures later. I would say that God is patient while the Devil is into imediate gratification.

No offense but we are talking about the same God that will send you to hell for not worshiping him right?
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  #24  
Old 08-08-2007, 12:04 AM
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nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
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Originally Posted by Kcnorwood View Post
No offense but we are talking about the same God that will send you to hell for not worshiping him right?

Not everyone believes that.
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  #25  
Old 08-08-2007, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted by nutshell View Post
Not everyone believes that.


You're right but I'm talking about the bibical God here. I still believe that in some ways you can't have believe in the bible but only pick & choose what suits you. I was just raised that way.
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  #26  
Old 08-08-2007, 12:26 AM
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nutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on treesnutshell thinks frubals grow on trees
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Originally Posted by Kcnorwood View Post
You're right but I'm talking about the bibical God here. I still believe that in some ways you can't have believe in the bible but only pick & choose what suits you. I was just raised that way.
i believe in the Bible and I don't pick and chose. The biblical God I believe in doesn't condemn people to hell.

Deal with it.
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  #27  
Old 08-08-2007, 06:45 AM
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I still don't see how Satan is a sacrifice. Doesn't being a sacrifice mean doing something for the benefit of others? Satan was only trying to benefit himself.
You have self-consciousness because of that suffering. It's by virtue of that self-concsiousness that you can find yourself in relation to "God." Satan rebelled so that you could love "God." That's quite a sacrifice.
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  #28  
Old 08-08-2007, 06:55 AM
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I would add that Jesus/"God" was no more or less selfish in sacrifice if you follow any of the various substitutionary atonement theories. Was Jesus crucified for the benefit of all? Not really. "God" couldn't forgive without demanding a sacrifice, so he sacrificed himself to appease himself.

Which raises the question, who was redeemed by that sacrifice? It seems to me that "God" was redeemed. After all, it was "God" who was holding a grudge and couldn't bring himself to not count people's sins against them - sins he gave them the free will to commit specifically so they could "love" him. Jesus died to redeem "God." If you want to say Satan rebelled for selfish purposes, then so did "God"/Jesus.
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  #29  
Old 08-08-2007, 09:34 AM
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