Religion and Science: Two Sides of the same Coin (ritual, soul)

[Popeyesays]

An interesting You Tube presentation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6V28gQFnnFA

Regards,
Scott

[doppelgänger]

The third side of the coin is art (or religion is a subset of art, take your pick).

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by doppelgänger

The third side of the coin is art (or religion is a subset of art, take your pick).

I can certainly accept that a coin has three sides. Materially and metaphorically.

"O ye recipients of the favours of God! In this new and wondrous Age, the unshakeable foundation is the teaching of sciences and arts. According to explicit Holy Texts, every child must be taught crafts and arts, to the degree that is needful. Wherefore, in every city and village, schools must be established and every child in that city or village is to engage in study to the necessary degree.
It followeth that whatever soul shall offer his aid to bring this about will assuredly be accepted at the heavenly Threshold, and extolled by the Company on high.
Since ye have striven hard toward this all-important end, it is my hope that ye will reap your reward from the Lord of clear tokens and signs, and that the glances of heavenly grace will turn your way."
(Abdu'l-Baha, Selections from the Writings of Abdu'l-Baha, p. 134)

Regards,
Scott

[doppelgänger]

"The religious geniuses of all ages have been distinguished by this kind of religious feeling, which knows no dogma and no God conceived in man's image; so that there can be no church whose central teachings are based on it. Hence it is precisely among the heretics of every age that we find men who were filled with this highest kind of religious feeling and were in many cases regarded by their contemporaries as atheists, sometimes also as saints. Looked at in this light, men like Democritus, Francis of Assisi, and Spinoza are closely akin to one another.

How can cosmic religious feeling be communicated from one person to another, if it can give rise to no definite notion of a God and no theology? In my view, it is the most important function of art and science to awaken this feeling and keep it alive in those who are receptive to it."


Albert Einstein,The World as I See It, Philosophical Library, New York, 1949, pp. 24 - 28

[Random]

Originally Posted by doppelgänger

"The religious geniuses of all ages have been distinguished by this kind of religious feeling, which knows no dogma and no God conceived in man's image; so that there can be no church whose central teachings are based on it. Hence it is precisely among the heretics of every age that we find men who were filled with this highest kind of religious feeling and were in many cases regarded by their contemporaries as atheists, sometimes also as saints. Looked at in this light, men like Democritus, Francis of Assisi, and Spinoza are closely akin to one another.

How can cosmic religious feeling be communicated from one person to another, if it can give rise to no definite notion of a God and no theology? In my view, it is the most important function of art and science to awaken this feeling and keep it alive in those who are receptive to it."


Albert Einstein,The World as I See It, Philosophical Library, New York, 1949, pp. 24 - 28

The "feeling" of cosmic religious awe cannot be transmitted from one person to another in our current state, precisely for three reasons: 1) It cannot be commoditised or contained as every instance of it is subjectively limitless, 2) We currently lack the empathic powers to form a direct link by which such ordinance may be experienced via another, 3) Language is insufficient to describe it, as linguistic constructs of any kind are inadequate to program anyones reality to a paradisical or supra-mundane consciousness (though this can be achieved in other ways, such as via meditation and/or higher knowlege).

I don't think the key thing is transmitting the religious state to another like a memetic virus, that has already been tried via centuries of mind control (dogma, doctrine, mass ritual etc), but rather teaching people how to attain to the statliness of being that allows the feeling or transcendent sensation into their lives, that makes it part of them and a part they realize in themselves.

Nice quote from Einstein, Dopp.

[doppelgänger]

Originally Posted by Random

I don't think the key thing is transmitting the religious state to another like a memetic virus, that has already been tried via centuries of mind control (dogma, doctrine, mass ritual etc), but rather teaching people how to attain to the statliness of being that allows the feeling or transcendent sensation into their lives, that makes it part of them and a part they realize in themselves.

Nice quote from Einstein, Dopp.

I agree Conor. For me, the key to the passage is the last part: "to awaken this feeling and keep it alive in those who are receptive to it." If one doesn't understand how the "heretics" and "atheists" of science and art are the most profoundly in tune with the cosmic religious feeling, then one isn't going to get much out of what they say and write - and will probably just end up confused at best and susceptible to being manipulated and mis-led at worst.

[Random]

Originally Posted by doppelgänger

I agree Conor. For me, the key to the passage is the last part: "to awaken this feeling and keep it alive in those who are receptive to it." If one doesn't understand how the "heretics" and "atheists" of science and art are the most profoundly in tune with the cosmic religious feeling, then one isn't going to get much out of what they say and write - and will probably just end up confused at best and susceptible to being manipulated and mis-led at worst.

True, but then many will intellectualize to the point that they throw out the possibility of a Source (code) for the feeling. I believe e-motions are a sort of code for cosmic communication myself -- the language of reality is entropy, is it not?

[doppelgänger]

Originally Posted by Random

True, but then many will intellectualize to the point that they throw out the possibility of a Source (code) for the feeling. I believe e-motions are a sort of code for cosmic communication myself -- the language of reality is entropy, is it not?

The "substance" of reality is entropy (that's a metaphor, BTW). The language of reality is language (i.e. order, logic).