Dispel my confusion, if you can... (Jesus, ritual, Creator, gospel)

[Random]

People often listen to me speak of things they think no ordinary man should know about (or bother themselves with) and react in generally one of two ways: either they are intrigued and find what I'm saying thought-provoking, or they think I'm semi-insane and immediately shun me like a weird person thereafter.

Now the former sort will find they have learnt something from me if they take what I say and apply it to their own life experience, but few will do this. Instead, they will most likely never pass the intellectual level and probably go off seeking sources for what I relate that don't exist in any way accessible to them.

The latter sort are low-minded, foolish people I often (against my own better judgement) end up regretting having given my time to. Even as regards them, I usually end up hoping I have somehow managed to sow a seed of doubt and uncertainty that might one day (or one lifetime) blossom anew in their hearts and minds and liberate them.

I would say one in every 10 people I talk with about spirituality, life and everything
actually understand what I'm saying. Of those 1-in-10 only a minority again would actually have the wit and the will to do anything about it. The rest essentially pretend to want to know, but run away @ once should the knowlege be forthcoming.

This situation has led me to many hours of wondering, long teatimes of the soul (so to speak). I am a good teacher according even to the people who don't accept what I say, but regardless, the point is that I have come to the conclusion that the reason I cannot transmit my teachings to others in a way that immediately impacts their spirit, which is awareness, and makes the dharma a transformative experience for the student (all the great spiritual Masters are said to have had this ability), is because although I don't like to admit it, I am still confused in some ways: even after all these years of learning and attainment in both the subjective and objective realms.

But confused about what, you might ask. Well what else? GOD. I possess a fine grasp of many things related to GOD, like philosophy, religion, esoterica (and exoterica), symbolism, cosmology, spiritual discipline etc. but I simply cannot decide once and for all whether I should believe in GOD or not. If it were as simple as following my heart, then I would speak from my intellect (which is never far from my heart) and say "No, there is no GOD, I do not believe", and that would be that. But it never lasts: for the truth is that somedays I do believe in GOD, and these are the days when I find myself acutely aware that it may not be what I KNOW that is so important, but rather what I DON'T know that is...

You see, it's like this: someone says to me something about GOD that I find agreeable to intellect and heart (like "GOD is Love and we are all born of Love) and I will then affirm that, saying "Yes, you're right". But five minutes later someone else will say something that I don't like about GOD (such as "GOD is our Father in heaven who will Judge us all for our sins and only the righteous will survive, the rest will perish in fire and brimstone!"), and I will say "No, you're deluded and possibly psychotic: your GOD does not exist". You see the problem? I only believe the versions of GOD acceptable to me and when I don't find them so, I throw the baby out with the bathwater and deny Him altogether. I simply have never found the middle ground, if there is any.

So there you have it: somedays I believe in GOD and somedays I don't. Frankly, it (my confusion) has gotten so bad these days that I will be theist/atheist inside the same hour if it suits the mood I'm in, or dependent upon which side of the bed I wake up on. But this is of course ridiculous and I feel it makes a fool of me...worse, I might be going crazy for real.

So, what am I in truth then? Am I a true believer scared to admit it, or a doubting Thomas sitting on the fence, or a closet atheist afraid to let go? I just don't know.

Can anybody advise me? Does any of this resonate with others here on RF? I welcome any comments or questions. Thanks in advance...

[doppelgänger]

I can only speak for myself, Conor, but I've learned a great deal by reading your posts, which are usually more than just thought-provoking.

[ayani]

Connor- i hear you on that. you're a bright, curious, intellectual person, and i'd say your head has taken you some remarkable places. follow your head and your heart... God, i have always believed, is too small to fit into any one creed or dogma.

[slabbey06]

Originally Posted by Random

People often listen to me speak of things they think no ordinary man should know about (or bother themselves with) and react in generally one of two ways: either they are intrigued and find what I'm saying thought-provoking, or they think I'm semi-insane and immediately shun me like a weird person thereafter.

Now the former sort will find they have learnt something from me if they take what I say and apply it to their own life experience, but few will do this. Instead, they will most likely never pass the intellectual level and probably go off seeking sources for what I relate that don't exist in any way accessible to them.

The latter sort are low-minded, foolish people I often (against my own better judgement) end up regretting having given my time to. Even as regards them, I usually end up hoping I have somehow managed to sow a seed of doubt and uncertainty that might one day (or one lifetime) blossom anew in their hearts and minds and liberate them.

I would say one in every 10 people I talk with about spirituality, life and everything
actually understand what I'm saying. Of those 1-in-10 only a minority again would actually have the wit and the will to do anything about it. The rest essentially pretend to want to know, but run away @ once should the knowlege be forthcoming.

This situation has led me to many hours of wondering, long teatimes of the soul (so to speak). I am a good teacher according even to the people who don't accept what I say, but regardless, the point is that I have come to the conclusion that the reason I cannot transmit my teachings to others in a way that immediately impacts their spirit, which is awareness, and makes the dharma a transformative experience for the student (all the great spiritual Masters are said to have had this ability), is because although I don't like to admit it, I am still confused in some ways: even after all these years of learning and attainment in both the subjective and objective realms.

But confused about what, you might ask. Well what else? GOD. I possess a fine grasp of many things related to GOD, like philosophy, religion, esoterica (and exoterica), symbolism, cosmology, spiritual discipline etc. but I simply cannot decide once and for all whether I should believe in GOD or not. If it were as simple as following my heart, then I would speak from my intellect (which is never far from my heart) and say "No, there is no GOD, I do not believe", and that would be that. But it never lasts: for the truth is that somedays I do believe in GOD, and these are the days when I find myself acutely aware that it may not be what I KNOW that is so important, but rather what I DON'T know that is...

You see, it's like this: someone says to me something about GOD that I find agreeable to intellect and heart (like "GOD is Love and we are all born of Love) and I will then affirm that, saying "Yes, you're right". But five minutes later someone else will say something that I don't like about GOD (such as "GOD is our Father in heaven who will Judge us all for our sins and only the righteous will survive, the rest will perish in fire and brimstone!"), and I will say "No, you're deluded and possibly psychotic: your GOD does not exist". You see the problem? I only believe the versions of GOD acceptable to me and when I don't find them so, I throw the baby out with the bathwater and deny Him altogether. I simply have never found the middle ground, if there is any.

So there you have it: somedays I believe in GOD and somedays I don't. Frankly, it (my confusion) has gotten so bad these days that I will be theist/atheist inside the same hour if it suits the mood I'm in, or dependent upon which side of the bed I wake up on. But this is of course ridiculous and I feel it makes a fool of me...worse, I might be going crazy for real.

So, what am I in truth then? Am I a true believer scared to admit it, or a doubting Thomas sitting on the fence, or a closet atheist afraid to let go? I just don't know.

Can anybody advise me? Does any of this resonate with others here on RF? I welcome any comments or questions. Thanks in advance...

Hi Random. I really appreciate your honesty in this post. I definitely don't think you're alone in your confusion. Here's a little of what I'm perceiving in your post, from the point of view of someone who believes in God, and that Jesus is God, just so you know where I'm coming from.
It sounds to me like you know things ABOUT God, but deep down you realize that there's more to it than that. It sounds to me what you long for is to know God personally. I think it was Augustine who said, "God has made us for Himself. And our hearts are not at rest until they rest in Him. But you struggle with certain aspects of who He is that you don't understand or don't like. I have no problem admitting that there are things God does that I don't understand, that I don't wonder, why didn't He do it this way instead? It's moments like that, when my mood tells me not to trust Him, that I have to look to His character. He is the Creator, I am the created, so I'm not going to understand all of His decisions. But He has said He is good, holy, just, merciful, gracious, righteous, etc etc... so I choose to trust Him (We all trust in something). He did after all love me enough to send His Son to die for me. Jesus came to pay a debt He didn't owe, because I owed a debt I couldn't pay. I hope I'm not coming across as "preachy" because that is not my intent.
I'm sure you're going to get lots of advice. Here's mine to add to the mix. I would suggest that you read the one of the Gospels like you've never read it before, you're approaching it for the first time. And then I'd say, "OK, if you really exist God, I don't want to be confused anymore. If you're real and this Book is really from You, let me know." See what happens?

[Random]

Thanks to all for the kind words and responses.

Ultimately, for me, regardless of whether Jesus was GOD or GOD never had a body or is Brahma or whatever framework you accept for the Absolute, the language we use to describe certain aspects of our shared reality is made redundant in the absence of the reference point or centre that the concept of GOD brings. I have found this and wished it were otherwise, but if I were to pretend this were not true then I would be lost, with no-one to find me. I won't ever settle for knowing so much that isn't so on every level and sense available. I cannot abide incompleteness, but a personal GOD (like Christ) provides too specific a reference point that men of great dishonour can impute their lies and half-truths upon for worldly ends, whilst and impersonal GOD (like the Universe) is lacking the interactive element of mind or soul that is essential to spiritual enlightenment and in any case is probably indifferent to our plight. So you see: atheist, pantheist, panentheist, monotheist, nontheist -- take your pick, I can be one or all of them on some level, yet none of them! It is truly absurd to the rational mind. I think I will figure it out in time...

[doppelgänger]

Originally Posted by Random

I think I will figure it out in time...

Why would you want to do that?

[Booko]

Originally Posted by Random

So you see: atheist, pantheist, panentheist, monotheist, nontheist -- take your pick, I can be one or all of them on some level, yet none of them! It is truly absurd to the rational mind. I think I will figure it out in time...

Perhaps the point is more about the questions than the answers?

[Willamena]

Originally Posted by Random