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#1
04-23-2007, 01:28 AM
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Christians and your problem of evil
Can it be answered? I have been reading about this for a little while, and I have not found anything convincing.
Take this example - A devout Christian is on trial for a muder he did not commit. The jury etc are all devout christians. False evidence is found and he is sentenced to death. Why does a loving God allow this? A common argument is that it was part of Gods 'grand plan' and is not evil. Is God so cold and calculating that he allows this innocent family man to die, just because it was part of his plan? If he is all powerful, and truely benevolent could he not just make a different plan so the man was allowed to live? And don't try and tell me he was better off dead... Also, what kind of God creates beings that instinctively kill and eat each other to survive!? It does not make sense to me. What are your thoughts? And, anyone care to enlighten me? 
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#2
04-23-2007, 01:44 AM
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Who knows? Why would any popularized myth propagate the notion that a divine "father" would purposefully sacrifice his only son by means of torturous execution, as some "example" of...what? I can not enlighten your sensibilities or understanding, for I remain of the estimation and conclusion that all faith-based claims are utter bunk.
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"Theology is the effort to explain the unknowable in terms of the not worth knowing. " -HL Mencken
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#3
04-23-2007, 04:13 AM
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Very good point!
First lets fix the Bible: Balaam Teaching Micah 6:6 says that, if God were to sacrifice any living thing would be equal to saying God would sacrifice his own son; So God didn’t, man did. So in other words the Bible its self stands against that. It only stems from the Pharisees (John, Paul, Simon the stone (peter)) teachings and not from the mouth of Yeshua or old testament verses concerning it. If we take into account what Yeshua (jesus) said word for word, as he taught people must do to follow him. Then in fact he said, to say he was a living sacrifice, implies you are guilty of it and follow them and not him and so shall get nothing (vine dressers son parable). The best verse is “if you knew what this meant, you wouldn’t sacrifice the innocent, I ask for mercy and not sacrifice” Mat 12:7 = “the knowledge of God is more important then all your burnt offerings” Hosea 6:6. So in other words Christians stand against Christ’s own teaching from a Biblical perspective. So why was he sent then: Zechariah 11 Potters field prophecy, clearly relates that God would offer a prophet for 30 pieces of silver, to cut off inheritance and grace (Hebrew word meanings needed); if the price was paid and put into the potter field, in the house of Israel. This we know Judas did to the letter, yet no one care to mention that fact and so continue with Jewish saying he wasn’t sent and Christian proclaiming something that Bible does not collaborate with. The actual price Yeshua does agree to take from people, if they follow all of that to the letter, and no two ways about it; there is one road in this and a very narrow path as that shows. He explains in many parables that the servant who is sent, help reduce the price of sin by half, in Isaiah 53 it uses the correct wording of an intercessor, as Yeshua also made clear. He passes on the message to the judge, if he is your friend and then that payment maybe reduced, yet still payment must be paid and is not taken. Hope that is bit clearer, Christians stand against Christ’s own teachings and follow Pharisee doctrine. There are absolutely loads and loads of old testament statements, prophecies to collaborate that as fact, and not in the slightest the Pharisees version….which is why Paul told people not to read the old testament, good job some of us know a fake prophet definition given in Jeremiah 23 to notice why he so wrong….and then simply he contradicts Yeshua own teachings on most things, as many top theologians have seen.
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Oneness - True Faith Last edited by wizanda; 04-23-2007 at 04:16 AM.
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#4
04-23-2007, 04:33 AM
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__________________
"I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them." -- Thomas Jefferson
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#5
04-23-2007, 04:43 AM
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As if you leave something to rot under a carpet, not only just it rot and smell, yet you also loose the carpet through it.
If you leave rotten water, that could be flowing, then you get mosquitoes, if the water gets infected we all do and get the same disease, even if we are ignoring the rotten water.
__________________
Oneness - True Faith
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#6
04-23-2007, 05:12 AM
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It may be pertinent to mention that I believe in reincarnation (unlike many Christians) - because that does "broaden the picture". Imagine God as being the Father of a very large family of children; those of you who are fathers will know that , as a father, there are times when you just can't protect your young. Certain lessons have to be learned by personal experience - maybe if you are young, you will remember being told not to do something by your parents - how did that affect your judgment ? - I know as a father, that if I told my sons not to do something, it made them all the more determined to do so (that is human nature). Being humans on Earth, there is absolutely no way that we can get by without sinning; show me a member of any religion who claims never to have sinned, and I would suspect him/her of either being dishonest, or deluded. The same applies outside religion - I am sure no atheist would ever claim never to have broken a law (even if it was going a bit faster in the car than the speed limit, finding a ten Dollar bill on the floor, and pocketing it..etc..). Your example:- Quote:
The entire process of living is to learn; my personal belief in reincarnation is one that allows me to realize that I will have many lives (as many as it will take me to learn everything that I need to learn, to be good enough to be returned to God); hell is - for me - being away from God, and in this physical body with a personality that is all too easily tempted into doing things I shouldn't really do (even if they are small things). Just like the father sees his son getting into debt (even though he has taught him thrift) - as has happened to me - I have a son who has run up credit card bills that were quite horrendous. because I love my son, I helped him repay them - on the condition that he repays us. Because he needs to learn his lesson; when he does, the chances are thats we will keep all that money separate, and give it back to him the day he settles down and decides to buy a house. But he needs to learn that money doesn't grow on trees; he got into debt, we are prepared to help him (in as much as we will save him all the interest it would cost him), but we want paying back - to make the point. Sure, the death of an innocent individual is not what is right, but it is part of a much larger process of people who have made mistakes (some, even perhaps on purpose) - the real culprit would have "got away with it" (maybe here on earth, but he won't when he sees his father  - who will (according to my beliefs), send him back down to learn the lesson of taking the blame for his own misdeeds in future.)Does that help ? To Gods, we are like "ants" are to us. Our lives (in the true perspective) are minute; just as we watch ants working away, having short lives is what we are to God except that we are his children). Sure he loves us - but here, we can't see "The bigger picture" all we see is our little microcosmic view of something that is beyond our comprehension.
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My life is an open book; if you don't like the read, put me back on the shelf ....................
Last edited by michel; 04-23-2007 at 05:16 AM.
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#7
04-23-2007, 05:41 AM
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Must say nice answer, does sound Christ like; especially with the reincarnation point included, as he taught on.
 Which is why then in me being Christ and now explaining why not to sacrifice innocent prophets, it would make allot of sense to many people....as written will happen…. 
__________________
Oneness - True Faith
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#8
04-23-2007, 07:53 AM
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Thanks for the replies. I understand that it is felt our lives are of minute importance in the grand scheme of things. I still cannot accept though that if a God loved us, he would allow a newborn baby to be beaten to death by its schizophrenic mother - Or, I don't like to use it but allow the recent university shooting. It is all so terrible. Even if we are minute, these peoples lives cannot be seen as unimportant in my eyes - even if it relates to the grand scheme of things. I guess that is an explanation - in the grand scheme of things, people are meant to die - lessons are meant to be learnt, etc. But I personally cannot accept that human life is treated so apathetically. Though, if you believe in reincarnation your theory works perfectly and is very apt. The problem is, many Christians (the majority, I would thnk) would call you blasphemous for your reincarnation beliefs.
Last edited by Sportman1987; 04-23-2007 at 07:55 AM.
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#9
04-23-2007, 09:18 AM
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The earth was not created to be a perfect place for souls to live rich happy lives. A place already exists for that, it's called heaven. If you don't like something here, fix it.
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#10
04-23-2007, 10:06 AM
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