Muslims Create Religious Tension in Minnosota (punishment, reject, America, preach)

[Mujahid Mohammed]

Originally Posted by UnityNow101

The oppression in many Islamic countries is based upon many traditions of men and NOT based on the texts of the Holy Quran. There are many oral traditions of the Prophet which in many respects should not be held in the same regard as the Quran. The Quran is not oppressive towards women or people of different faiths, whereas many traditions are. The oppression and brutality should in no way be attributed to the Blessed Book, the Quran, but rather to the "traditions of men."

Not just any men but non musim men for muslims have an Islamic tradition which cannot be altered or added to. True muslims with true knowledge. Unity Now that was Well said, now if we can get everyone to see that part of it that way then they will have the correct understanding.

[Quoth The Raven]

Originally Posted by fullyveiled muslimah

What happens when the beliefs of Australia are in direct contrast to a person's belief in God or whatever else? WHat if accepting those beliefs nullify my own? Then I should still clear off?

To be fair, the point he was trying to make - and this came up after the fracas in Cronulla when the muslim community itself stood up and said, that they had failed in some way in the raising of their children to understand the distinction between what you could reasonably expect from a Muslim and a non Muslim in terms of dress and behaviour (in my experience - and I lived as a child in an area largely inhabited by Muslim immigrants from the Middle East - the first generation immigrants here are rarely any trouble, the issues pop up in the next generation, which appears to be a troubled transitional phase in all nationalities of immigrant) - is that if you wish to be an Australian and live in Australia, then you need to be prepared to teach your children the culture in order to understand it. To understand the differences and to understand that in some areas there is a huge cultural difference and you can't judge a non Muslim by the same standards as you would use to judge someone else of your faith. To understand that there will be very open public displays of affection between people in the street, that women will wear short skirts and skimpy tops, that this is part of what happens here and it needs to be accepted. Just as it needs to be accepted that a Subway owned by a Muslim isn't going to have ham subs, or there are going to be other things that we accept as normal that Muslims can't do because of their religion.
It makes it more difficult when you have the odd trouble makers - some of which are quite prominent - going all over the place, getting on TV and saying things along the lines of,'Muslims have more right to be here than the people who were born here, and more right to mold the country as we see fit, because we chose this country to live in'and you lot just happened to be here by an accident of birth.', and stuff that essentially translates to,'You can't blame a guy for raping a scantily dressed woman, because she's essentially uncovered meat and if you leave uncovered meat out, you can't blame the cats for eating it.' These people don't do anyone any favours, and they certainly don't foster understanding and tolerance between the Muslim and non Muslim community.

[TashaN]

Originally Posted by Quoth The Raven

'You can't blame a guy for raping a scantily dressed woman, because she's essentially uncovered meat and if you leave uncovered meat out, you can't blame the cats for eating it.'

The Muslims there condemned the one who said this. What is really ironic is when a non-Muslims say very offensive things then people like you will come over and say why the fuss?

Can't you see the double standard?

[Quoth The Raven]

Originally Posted by The Truth

The Muslims there condemned the one who said this. What is really ironic is when a non-Muslims say very offensive things then people like you will come over and say why the fuss?

Can't you see the double standard?

Actually, the very first thing that happens every time that particular individual opens his mouth and says stuff like that, or,'No, those boys who brutally pack raped those girls didn't really pack rape those girls, that was consensual sex' is that the more prominent members of the Muslim community in Austraia shoot into damage control mode and run around claiming that he's been misquoted - yet again - and he didn't really mean what he said. For him to mean so little of what he gets on tv and says means that someone is either making excuses, or the man is a halfwit. Unfortunately this isn't about the wider Muslim community in Australia, this is about a high profile individual who is deemed to represent them. They're not gtting their collective heads on tv, he is.
I'm sorry if you don't agree, but I still reserve the right for anyone to hold and voice an opinion of diety that conflicts with yours, and if you can't see the difference between someone - anyone, be he Mufti, the Pope, or the Archbishop of Canterbury or that funny little man in the trenchcoat down the street -saying something that condones or excuses a crime and that, then I would think your perspective skewed at the very least.
Now, before you brand me any more - though you've been excelling in it so far, so why stop when you're on a roll - perhaps you might like to have a little look at the number of times I've defended Muslims on here in the past, against such things as that whole 'You're prophet's a paedophile' thing that keeps coming up, amongst other things.
'People like me', defend your right to believe what you do as well as your right to not be labelled as anything because of it. We defend you rights to build a mosque where you want to, even if the local residents sook up because they'd rather it was somewhere else. We defend the rights of Muslim women to be allowed days at the local swimming pool and gym where there are no men allowed.
'People like me', also defend the rights of others to hold and express opinions that someone else might not like about beings they deem to probably be fictional characters with not very nice personalities and a lack of intelligence.
Now are you going to get over this, or would you prefer to just reply to the occasional post I might make in order to hold a petty grudge? If so, I suggest you actually find out what 'people like me' actually are before you display any more ignorance on that matter.
On the other hand, you could just quote my post, edit it to leave out the relevent bits and claim that anyone who reads this will know what I'm really all about. I wouldn't assume they haven't actually read the unabridged version or been unintelligent or incapable enough to decipher what I've actually said before they get to your version though, so that may not work quite well as you think.

[Victor]

I'm a wanna-be Libertarian and still have some beef I need to resolve with it. The thing is that every ideology (theist or not) is free to place their input into secular law. It is only the more fundamentalist type that push to have no religious input at all (so long as there is some empirical plane they can work off of). The American system was intended to work or serve the entirety of, "We the people..." in relation to how "We the people..." interpret limitations of governmental power.

If a Muslim doesn’t want to sell, distribute, etc. pork, then he/she shouldn’t have to. Although I do believe all liberties and freedoms should be extended the The people I also believe we have the liberty to oppose it through our American system. We do so already, so what’s different?

[TashaN]

Originally Posted by Quoth The Raven

Unfortunately this isn't about the wider Muslim community in Australia, this is about a high profile individual who is deemed to represent them. They're not gtting their collective heads on tv, he is.

I'm sorry if you don't agree, but I still reserve the right for anyone to hold and voice an opinion of diety that conflicts with yours, and if you can't see the difference between someone - anyone, be he Mufti, the Pope, or the Archbishop of Canterbury or that funny little man in the trenchcoat down the street -saying something that condones or excuses a crime and that, then I would think your perspective skewed at the very least.

Please read post # 37 & 38 in the link below in order to understand excatly what i meant.

When is a martyr not a martyr?

Now are you going to get over this, or would you prefer to just reply to the occasional post I might make in order to hold a petty grudge? If so, I suggest you actually find out what 'people like me' actually are before you display any more ignorance on that matter.

So just because "people like you" defended in the past what they believe to be true whether about Muslims or others so i should be grateful and shut my mouth when i see something i disagree with?

Is that what you mean?