Why Don't We Need Prophets Anymore? (mystic, elder, church, Revelation)

[Booko]

Originally Posted by beckysoup61

MUSLIMS
Why can't their be anymore prophets after Muhammad?

Hopefully some of our Muslim friend will pop in, but I'll answer from the pov of the different way we interpret one of the titles of Muhammad "Seal of the Prophets."

It is the common belief among Muslims that this means that after Muhammad, no prophets.

We believe that as the Arabic word used for "prophet" is "nabi" (minor prophet) that means that we should expect a Daniel or Hosea. The Arabic word "rasul" means major prophet, like Moses, Jesus or Muhammad. The title "Seal of the Prophet" doesn't imply an end to the "rasuls."

If you consider this, it would make sense. From Muhammad's time on, humanity has done a much better job in terms of speedier communication, putting things in writing, and having a much larger worldview. So why would we need a "minor" prophet, whose job it is to call us back to an existing religion?" It's not like anyone's lost the text of the Qu'ran. Unlike many other religions, Muslims don't have to waste time debating which texts are authentic and which aren't. (They save that for hadith. )

That doesn't mean we don't need any "major" prophets, though.

Even in Islam, there are prophecies about the appearance of figures known by names such as the Mahdi, Qaim, Tenth Imim, and the like.

If these references are not to someone who is a prophet, then what sort of figure *do* they refer to?

ANYONE ELSE
Your opinions are welcome, but I'm pretty sure most of you don't believe in prophets in the first place -- so it's kind of be redundant to ask.

Well, you left Baha'is out, and we do believe in prophets, but I'm guessing you didn't include us because you know for us the question is kinda moot.

[Victor]

Originally Posted by Booko

Hopefully some of our Muslim friend will pop in, but I'll answer from the pov of the different way we interpret one of the titles of Muhammad "Seal of the Prophets."

It is the common belief among Muslims that this means that after Muhammad, no prophets.

We believe that as the Arabic word used for "prophet" is "nabi" (minor prophet) that means that we should expect a Daniel or Hosea. The Arabic word "rasul" means major prophet, like Moses, Jesus or Muhammad. The title "Seal of the Prophet" doesn't imply an end to the "rasuls."

If you consider this, it would make sense. From Muhammad's time on, humanity has done a much better job in terms of speedier communication, putting things in writing, and having a much larger worldview. So why would we need a "minor" prophet, whose job it is to call us back to an existing religion?" It's not like anyone's lost the text of the Qu'ran. Unlike many other religions, Muslims don't have to waste time debating which texts are authentic and which aren't. (They save that for hadith. )

That doesn't mean we don't need any "major" prophets, though.

Even in Islam, there are prophecies about the appearance of figures known by names such as the Mahdi, Qaim, Tenth Imim, and the like.

If these references are not to someone who is a prophet, then what sort of figure *do* they refer to?


Well, you left Baha'is out, and we do believe in prophets, but I'm guessing you didn't include us because you know for us the question is kinda moot.

Learned something new.......Gracias.....

[Booko]

Originally Posted by sojourner

We now have the Holy Spirit to guide us. Isn't that enough? Can the H.S. not guide people to prophesy, even if they're not "official" -- as James said?

It seems to me that even in English we have more than one usage of the term "prophet." If we can find a way to be clearer about what me mean by "prophet" it sure would help!

One version is a person who just predicts the future. In the religious context, I think this too narrow and not a very useful definition.

A second version is an otherwise normal individual who has the gift of prophecy. To me, this is more like someone who's very good at listening to the HS, and might be called "inspired." They do not speak with the authority of God, even though they are tapped into the HS. (This is what you're referring to, yes, Sojourner?)

A third version is people like the Biblical "minor prophets." They get a message from God more directly than us mere individuals who have the gift of prophesy. They speak with authority, but they call people back to a religion that already exists.

A fourth version is people that start entire new religions, like Moses, Jesus, Krishna, Zoroaster, Muhammad, and Baha'u'llah. Like the minor prophets, they appear to be different than just a person who has the gift of prophesy. They do NOT call people back to an existing religion -- they build upon an existing one. They also speak with authority, but unlike minor prophets, they have the authority to overturn social laws* that have outlived their usefulness, and add new social laws that are needed for the times.

*Social law: laws such as marriage and divorce laws, inheritance laws, dietary laws, details on how and when to pray, etc.

*Universal law: Core laws that demand honesty, loving your neighbor, treating others well, that are present in all religions.

[BruceDLimber]

Greetings!

I'm a Baha'i, and IOV Divine Messengers (sometimes called prophets) are not only needed periodically, but will never cease to appear!

God typically sends a new one every 500-1,000 years, and He renews religion (founding a new religion in the process) and gives us God's new teachings for the current Age! We thus receive continuing Divine Guidance if only we are spiritual enough and wise enough to recognize it.

IOV the latest such Messenger came about a century and a half ago (bringing many new volumes of scripture in the process and founding the Baha'i Faith); He has promised us that there will be another in the endless stream of such Messengers after a thousand years or so....

And all these religions build upon each other and are part of a single ever-evolving faith, the Faith of God!

Best, :-)

Bruce

[dawny0826]

Why doesn't the world need a prophet?

We HAVE the greatest prophet...Jesus Christ...who is the same TODAY within his believers as He was yesterday and will be forever.

Wouldn't you think it is so much more wicked then in biblical times?

Wicked in what way?

The bible states that in the latter days, many will prophesie. I believe very much that some are given the gift of prophesy for edification of the church...however, I don't think that there is ONE SINGULAR or profound living prophet that anyone should be turning to for revelation.

We have CHRIST. And anyone who truly prophesies is receiving their information from God Almighty. Where does Christ Jesus reside? Within the heart of the believer. We have what we need within ourselves and within the pages of God's Holy Word.

Why would God leave His people wiht a guidance in the wilderness?

He didn't, Becky. As promised, He sent us the Holy Spirit to guide, comfort and teach us.

When one receives Christ...they receive the Holy Spirit, as promised. We have not been left alone in the wildnerness. The answers we seek are found in Christ...who lives within each believer.

[Halcyon]

To me a prophet is someone who receives divine revelation. All they need to do to be a prophet is write down that revelation.
If people then read that message and consider the author a prophet because the message makes sense to them then so be it, other people will not consider them a prophet and that's fine too.

If someone goes a step further and claims to be a prophet, similar to that Maitreya guy in another recent thread, i automatically distrust them. I don't think people can be a permanent prophet, and thus everything they say comes straight from God - such a thing would be open to obvious abuse.

Instead i think the label of prophet must be given to someone on the merit of the revelation given, and that the label is not permanent otherwise any old crap they make up could become doctrine.
Thus, although i think there could be many prophets living right now, i doubt they are self-proclaimed prophets or hold the position of Prophet within an organisation.

[lunamoth]

A prophet is someone who sees past the illusion of what everyone knows to what truely is. We always need and always have prophets among us.

[Victor]

Unless we define what a prophet is, we will be talking French to Spanish and never get anywhere. Ok I'll start:


(1) General Idea -- The Hebrew Prophet was not merely, as the word commonly implies, a man enlightened by God to foretell events; he was the interpreter and supernaturally enlightened herald sent by Yahweh to communicate His will and designs to Israel. His mission consisted in preaching as well as in foretelling. He had to maintain and develop the knowledge of the Old Law among the Chosen People, lead them back when they strayed, and gradually prepare the way for the new kingdom of God, which the messias was to establish on earth. Prophecy, in general, signifies the supernatural message of the Prophet, and more especially, from custom, the predictive element of the prophetic message.

(2) The Hebrew Names -- The ordinary Hebrew word for prophet is nabî'. Its etymology is uncertain. According to many recent critics, the root nabî, not employed in Hebrew, signified to speak enthusiastically, " to utter cries, and make more or less wild gestures", like the pagan mantics. Judging from a comparative examination of the cognate words in Hebrew and the other Semitic tongues, it is at least equally probable that the original meaning was merely: to speak, to utter words (cf. Laur, "Die Prophetennamen des A.T.", Fribourg, 1903, 14-38). The historic meaning of nabî' established by biblical usage is "interpreter and mouthpiece of God". This is forcibly illustrated by the passage, where Moses, excusing himself from speaking to Pharao on account of his embarrassment of speech, was answered by Yahweh: "Behold I have appointed thee the God of Pharao: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet. Thou shalt speak to him all that I command thee; and he shall speak to Pharao, that he let the children of Israel go out of his land" (Exodus 7:1-2). Moses plays towards the King of Egypt the role of God, inspiring what is to be uttered, and Aaron is the prophet, his mouthpiece, transmitting the inspired message he shall receive. The Greek prophetes (from pro-phanai, to speak for, or in the name of someone) translates the Hebrew word accurately. The Greek prophet was the revealer of the future, and the interpreter of divine things, especially of the obscure oracles of the pythoness. Poets were the prophets of the muses: Inspire me, muse, thy prophet I shall be" (Pindar, Bergk, Fragm. 127).
The word nabî' expresses more especially a function. The two most usual synonyms ro'éeh and hozéh emphasize more clearly the special source of the prophetic knowledge, the vision, that is, the Divine revelation or inspiration. Both have almost the same meaning; hozéh is employed, however, much more frequently in poetical language and almost always in connexion with a supernatural vision, whereas râ'ah, of which ro'éh is the participle, is the usual word for to see in any manner. The compiler of the first book of Kings (ix, 9) informs us that before his time ro'éh was used where nabî' was then employed. Hozéh is found much more frequently from the days of Amos. There were other less specific or more unusual terms employed, the meaning of which is clear, such as, messenger of God, man of God, servant of God, man of the spirit, or inspired man, etc. It is only rarely, and at a later period, that prophecy is called nebû'ah, a cognate of nabî'; more ordinarily we find hazôn, vision, or word of God, oracle (ne um) of Yahweh, etc.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12477a.htm