Religion and Abortion (birth control, contradiction, beliefs, minority, choice)

[Mr Spinkles]

I agree that making abortion illegal wouldn't stop abortions entirely, just as making cocaine illegal won't stop all cocaine use. However, abortion rates have increased since Roe v Wade (though they are currently decreasing).

I think if abortions were made illegal (except when medically required) abortion rates would drop, just as if anything were made illegal. I think more women would choose adoption rather than back alley abortions. Today about one in every four pregnancies ends in abortion.
http://www.publicagenda.com/issues/f...ion&list=3

Why are abortion and keeping the baby the only two options? Why not give the child up for adoption, to a family who wants a baby and has means to support him/her?

What about late term abortions (though very rare) in which the baby inside could be delivered and live on its own outside the body (with the aid of doctors, of course- like all premature newborns)?

In partial birth abortions (which are currently legal) the baby could survive outside the womb if delivered fully, but instead is delivered feet first so that the skull can be split open and the brains sucked out. I apologize for being graphic, but I don't understand why this procedure doesn't fill pro choice people with horror, as it does me.

[Mr Spinkles]

I agree that making abortion illegal wouldn't stop abortions entirely, just as making cocaine illegal won't stop all cocaine use. However, abortion rates have increased since Roe v Wade (though they are currently decreasing).

I think if abortions were made illegal (except when medically required) abortion rates would drop, just as if anything were made illegal. I think more women would choose adoption rather than back alley abortions. Today about one in every four pregnancies ends in abortion.
http://www.publicagenda.com/issues/f...ion&list=3

Why are abortion and keeping the baby the only two options? Why not give the child up for adoption, to a family who wants a baby and has means to support him/her?

What about late term abortions (though very rare) in which the baby inside could be delivered and live on its own outside the body (with the aid of doctors, of course- like all premature newborns)?

In partial birth abortions (which are currently legal) the baby could survive outside the womb if delivered fully, but instead is delivered feet first so that the skull can be split open and the brains sucked out. I apologize for being graphic, but I don't understand why this procedure doesn't fill pro choice people with horror, as it does me.

[OctoberTheHottie]

Originally Posted by Mr_Spinkles

In partial birth abortions (which are currently legal) the baby could survive outside the womb if delivered fully, but instead is delivered feet first so that the skull can be split open and the brains sucked out. I apologize for being graphic, but I don't understand why this procedure doesn't fill pro choice people with horror, as it does me.

I have never heard of that, that is just unbelievable to me that someone would think of such a procedure to do.....

But in my opinion on the whole thing, I have said this before, although it would never happen, I think a good solution to the problem would be if abortion were made illegal and that anyone under 21 should have to legally give thier baby up for adoption to a family waiting on an adoption list. Now I am pro-choice, but teens, as well as irresponsible adults have made this into just another form of birth control, it is so normal and I don't think it should be that way. Not to mention once you get up to a high amount of abortions you are really starting to cause damage for yourself... There should be something into getting people to realize that you need to think about this before the problem, not after.

Originally Posted by Mr_Spinkles

I don't support making abortion illegal when it is a necessary medical procedure.

And in the case of medical danger to keep the mother or baby from being injured and the doctor has to recommend an abortion, it is called denaturalization and that will always be legal, it is not considered an abortion and would not be affected by laws.... Why would they illegalize that when adult lives could be lost or the baby could be born dead and all that could be avoided?? I don't think the two go hand in hand, illegalizing abortion would mean no more after the fact birth control, and unfortunately rape victims would have to either keep thier baby or put it up for adoption, but those would be the only two things affected....

[OctoberTheHottie]

Originally Posted by Mr_Spinkles

In partial birth abortions (which are currently legal) the baby could survive outside the womb if delivered fully, but instead is delivered feet first so that the skull can be split open and the brains sucked out. I apologize for being graphic, but I don't understand why this procedure doesn't fill pro choice people with horror, as it does me.

I have never heard of that, that is just unbelievable to me that someone would think of such a procedure to do.....

But in my opinion on the whole thing, I have said this before, although it would never happen, I think a good solution to the problem would be if abortion were made illegal and that anyone under 21 should have to legally give thier baby up for adoption to a family waiting on an adoption list. Now I am pro-choice, but teens, as well as irresponsible adults have made this into just another form of birth control, it is so normal and I don't think it should be that way. Not to mention once you get up to a high amount of abortions you are really starting to cause damage for yourself... There should be something into getting people to realize that you need to think about this before the problem, not after.

Originally Posted by Mr_Spinkles

I don't support making abortion illegal when it is a necessary medical procedure.

And in the case of medical danger to keep the mother or baby from being injured and the doctor has to recommend an abortion, it is called denaturalization and that will always be legal, it is not considered an abortion and would not be affected by laws.... Why would they illegalize that when adult lives could be lost or the baby could be born dead and all that could be avoided?? I don't think the two go hand in hand, illegalizing abortion would mean no more after the fact birth control, and unfortunately rape victims would have to either keep thier baby or put it up for adoption, but those would be the only two things affected....

[painted wolf]

well... knowing victems of rape and thier struggle over such issues.. I can't say anyone has the right to tell them to give birth ...

can you imagine haveing to carry the child of your attacker?... Having that constant reminder of the violence and humiliation forced on you by society?

wa:-do

[painted wolf]

well... knowing victems of rape and thier struggle over such issues.. I can't say anyone has the right to tell them to give birth ...

can you imagine haveing to carry the child of your attacker?... Having that constant reminder of the violence and humiliation forced on you by society?

wa:-do

[OctoberTheHottie]

Yeah, but that is really besides the point, when you can get a morning after pill, I had forgot about that when I made that post.

I mostly only support illegalizing abortion over teen's view of it as birth control, but since every age group would have to suffer through it as well, there are other options. I just look at it as everyone needs to make a conscience effort. Rape victims need to come forward and get treatment, teens need to make it their responsibility to take this more seriously. And adults need to be more responsible too.... Whether law should be what forces us to do that or not, I dunno, but that is just my opinion.... It just looks cut and dry to me, on one hand you have families dying to adopt a child they can raise as thier own, and on the other hand you have babies being killed everyday because teens are too young to handle it. How much more simple can it get?? If everyone knew 100% without a doubt that if you get pregnant under age your only choice is to give it up for adoption I would think that would make them think twice about whether they wanted to take 9 months out of thier life to deal with that. I don't think they should have the right to keep it because they aren't prepared and the child will suffer not to mention they will be on welfare. I know that is a pipe dream though because I think it would force more kids into trying to do it themselves. So I certainly wouldn't want that. It is a tough world we live in..... It's almost like we have been backed into a corner on this one, it doesn't look like there is any happy way to change this matter....

[OctoberTheHottie]

Yeah, but that is really besides the point, when you can get a morning after pill, I had forgot about that when I made that post.

I mostly only support illegalizing abortion over teen's view of it as birth control, but since every age group would have to suffer through it as well, there are other options. I just look at it as everyone needs to make a conscience effort. Rape victims need to come forward and get treatment, teens need to make it their responsibility to take this more seriously. And adults need to be more responsible too.... Whether law should be what forces us to do that or not, I dunno, but that is just my opinion.... It just looks cut and dry to me, on one hand you have families dying to adopt a child they can raise as thier own, and on the other hand you have babies being killed everyday because teens are too young to handle it. How much more simple can it get?? If everyone knew 100% without a doubt that if you get pregnant under age your only choice is to give it up for adoption I would think that would make them think twice about whether they wanted to take 9 months out of thier life to deal with that. I don't think they should have the right to keep it because they aren't prepared and the child will suffer not to mention they will be on welfare. I know that is a pipe dream though because I think it would force more kids into trying to do it themselves. So I certainly wouldn't want that. It is a tough world we live in..... It's almost like we have been backed into a corner on this one, it doesn't look like there is any happy way to change this matter....

[Mr Spinkles]

I cannot even begin to imagine how horrible that must be, painted wolf. Still, I think late term and partial birth abortion is a hideous solution to the problem.

I admit that the morning after pill and other kinds of procedures to stop very early pregnancy do not seem so inhumane to me--it's harder to feel bad for a group of embryotic cells than it is for a thumb-sucking, kicking, fully developed baby ready to be born.

But I no more support killing a baby caused by rape a couple of days before its born than I do a couple of days after its born. The question is where to draw the line. In my opinion it's been drawn barbaricly so that as long as a baby's head is still inside the womb, it can be killed.

At some point (right now it's the point at which the head leaves the womb) the child's right to be alive supercedes the imposed responsibility on the mother.

[Mr Spinkles]

I cannot even begin to imagine how horrible that must be, painted wolf. Still, I think late term and partial birth abortion is a hideous solution to the problem.

I admit that the morning after pill and other kinds of procedures to stop very early pregnancy do not seem so inhumane to me--it's harder to feel bad for a group of embryotic cells than it is for a thumb-sucking, kicking, fully developed baby ready to be born.

But I no more support killing a baby caused by rape a couple of days before its born than I do a couple of days after its born. The question is where to draw the line. In my opinion it's been drawn barbaricly so that as long as a baby's head is still inside the womb, it can be killed.

At some point (right now it's the point at which the head leaves the womb) the child's right to be alive supercedes the imposed responsibility on the mother.