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  #1  
Old 12-30-2012, 08:05 AM
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Default INDISPUTABLE Rational Proof That God Exists (Or Existed)

Whether God is an all-knowing being, or a thoughtless being non-existent anymore, something had to start the first thing, the first science, and science cannot and will not ever explain the start of science, just as something cannot create itself. Before anything, there was nothing. Something transcendent, existent before anything, had to create the first something. That, we call God.
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  #2  
Old 12-30-2012, 08:08 AM
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Lol welcome to the forum.
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  #3  
Old 12-30-2012, 08:09 AM
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Not to be mean to athiests but every time i see an athiest rip on a religious person i just wanna slap them with this statement.
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  #4  
Old 12-30-2012, 08:10 AM
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Yawn. First cause arguments have been around forever, and they've never been particularly convincing, let alone indisputable. For one thing, if everything needs a cause, then wouldn't God require a cause as well? And if you propose that God is an exception, that means exceptions are allowed, so why not just make things simpler and claim that the Universe is an exception to things requiring causes?

There's also always the strange conclusion, that doesn't follow from any of the previous premises, that we should just call this first cause "God". Why? What if the first cause was just some random quantum mechanic event. Why do we call that God? Should that really be considered God?

Oh, and P.S., humans started science. And last I checked, we ain't gods.
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  #5  
Old 12-30-2012, 08:11 AM
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Well don't you think you just did the same?
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Falvlun View Post
Yawn. First cause arguments have been around forever, and they've never been particularly convincing, let alone indisputable. For one thing, if everything needs a cause, then wouldn't God require a cause as well? And if you propose that God is an exception, that means exceptions are allowed, so why not just make things simpler and claim that the Universe is an exception to things requiring causes?

There's also always the strange conclusion, that doesn't follow from any of the previous premises, that we should just call this first cause "God". Why? What if the first cause was just some random quantum mechanic event. Why do we call that God? Should that really be considered God?

Oh, and P.S., humans started science. And last I checked, we ain't gods.
Well one of the attributes of god is that he is un-created and the creator of all things.
Logic does say that there has to be something that is eternal because something had to came to existence.
It comes to the basic that nothing cant create something and even random quantum mechanic do not come out of nothing or exist of nothing.
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevino434 View Post
Whether God is an all-knowing being, or a thoughtless being non-existent anymore, something had to start the first thing, the first science, and science cannot and will not ever explain the start of science, just as something cannot create itself.
Then where did God come from?

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Before anything, there was nothing. Something transcendent, existent before anything, had to create the first something. That, we call God.
This is a contradiction. First you say there was nothing before anything and then you say that something transcendent existed before anything
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Old 12-30-2012, 08:17 AM
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Greetings, new guy!
Your assumptions lead you to believe in a supreme being.
But they work only if they're true. This is not known.
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  #9  
Old 12-30-2012, 08:17 AM
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Well one of the attributes of god is that he is un-created and the creator of all things.
How do you know that an attribute of the Universe is that it is uncreated? I mean, if we are just making up attributes of unknown entities, why can't I make up attributes of unknown entities as well?

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Logic does say that there has to be something that is eternal because something had to came to existence.
So, why couldn't the universe be eternal?

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Originally Posted by F0uad View Post
It comes to the basic that nothing cant create something.
Actually, I don't know if we know that for sure. Physics is kinda complicated and weird.
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  #10  
Old 12-30-2012, 08:17 AM
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Yes but the first thing was caused by something. Whatever that thing is, it transcends (not in religious context) the natural laws of the universe. That thing is called God. It could be a random event, and the cause of that random event is God. Not saying God is anything more than the cause of the first thing. I'm completely fine with people believing anything they want, and i believe in science but science will never be able to prove that the universe was created through science because the first thing created will never have a creator that obeys the laws of the universe and science. (btw by science I mean the laws of the universe etc.)
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