Why does God have to cripple us first?

[Nowhere Man]

Originally Posted by rusra02

Please read the book of Job again, or just the first two chapters. God did not bring suffering upon Job, although he permitted it. Satan was responsible for Job's suffering. "Satan went out away from the person of Jehovah and struck Job with a malignant boil from the sole of his foot to the crown of his head." (Job 2:7)
Please do not blame God for what the Bible clearly shows were acts of the Devil.

God just watched to prove a point. He's totally innocent.

[rusra02]

Originally Posted by idav

God is responsible and the story is a clear indication of God allowing what happens to us. How would you feel if your father let one of his employees torment you cause he thought you needed more discipline? For a wager no less.

This was no mere "wager", nor was Job being disciplined. The book of Job reveals one of the great moral issues or challenges Satan raised against God. Satan had successfully turned Adam and Eve into rebels against God. Now he charged that all humans serve God only out of selfishness, and that when tested, men would "curse you to your very face." (Job 1:6-11) Rather than destroy Satan or ignore his challenge, God allowed Satan to attack Job. Job's record of integrity helps us to know this issue affects each one of us. Will we "curse God" if we suffer, or will we continue to acknowledge God's rightful sovereignty?
Thus, the book of Job helps us understand Satan's evil influence in the world, that his challenge against God also includes us, and that God gives each of us the privilege to answer Satan's challenge as Job did, as Jesus did, and many others have done. God does not owe us protection nor even life, and the clearing of his Name is far more important than any temporary suffering we may need to endure. As Job reveals, God did not permit Satan to kill Job, and after the test concluded with Satan proved a liar, God restored and blessed Job. James 5:11 says: "Look! We pronounce happy those who have endured. You have heard of the endurance of Job and have seen the outcome Jehovah gave, that Jehovah is very tender in affection and merciful."

[Nowhere Man]

Job's seven sons and three daughters? Guess that's the breaks. Tough luck for the rest. RIP for the cannon fodder.

[connermt]

Originally Posted by The Doors of Perception

First off, I am talking about the Abrahamic god in this thread, no other gods that may exist.

A friend told me to pray to this god and see what happened. Open minded as I am, I tried several times. My life got worse and I asked him why. He said because god was showing how much I need him.

Ok, problem. Why must god tear us down before we can lean on him? People call it trials, which is a fine term for me. Why, to get one's devotion, does god make us suffer? It seems quite evil to me, also quite against god's whole image it wants us to buy into.

Discuss.

Terrible for sure.
An all powerful, loving god making your life a living hell in order to get your attention. What, he can't create a purple unicorn with his name written on its side in your living room? Not sure about you, but that would get my attention more than just about anything.

Just like Job. God killed all that Job loved: his family, livelihood, means of physical survival...for what?
To prove a point to the devil.
And people still worship this thing? Masochists for sure.

[rusra02]

Originally Posted by Nowhere Man

Job's seven sons and three daughters? Guess that's the breaks. Tough luck for the rest. RIP for the cannon fodder.

They have the hope to be resurrected back to life in God's due time, as will Job and the rest of his family. (Acts 24:15)

[Pegg]

Originally Posted by The Doors of Perception

First off, I am talking about the Abrahamic god in this thread, no other gods that may exist.

A friend told me to pray to this god and see what happened. Open minded as I am, I tried several times. My life got worse and I asked him why. He said because god was showing how much I need him.

Ok, problem. Why must god tear us down before we can lean on him? People call it trials, which is a fine term for me. Why, to get one's devotion, does god make us suffer? It seems quite evil to me, also quite against god's whole image it wants us to buy into.

Discuss.

that is certainly not how it works. God does not test us and the scriptures clearly tell us that God does not put trials upon us.
James 1:13 When under trial, let no one say: “I am being tried by God.” For with evil things God cannot be tried nor does he himself try anyone

Some people think that praying is about asking God for stuff we want. Well it isnt. Jesus taught us how to pray and what is important to pray about. Personal needs and wants should be restricted to food clothing and shelter...our basic needs.

But we also need to be doing what he asks of us if we want him to hear us.

[Heathen Hammer]

Originally Posted by rusra02

They have the hope to be resurrected back to life in God's due time, as will Job and the rest of his family. (Acts 24:15)

Poor compensation for being murdered as an example. Im sure God's excuse wasn't acceptable for them, either.

[rusra02]

Originally Posted by Heathen Hammer

Poor compensation for being murdered as an example. Im sure God's excuse wasn't acceptable for them, either.

Satan murdered them, not God. Job became more concerned about himself than with understanding God's purpose. God corrected him: "Should there be any contending with a faultfinder with the Almighty? Let the reprover of God himself answer it." In Job's case, he wisely accepted the correction.

[9Westy9]

Originally Posted by The Doors of Perception

First off, I am talking about the Abrahamic god in this thread, no other gods that may exist.

A friend told me to pray to this god and see what happened. Open minded as I am, I tried several times. My life got worse and I asked him why. He said because god was showing how much I need him.

Ok, problem. Why must god tear us down before we can lean on him? People call it trials, which is a fine term for me. Why, to get one's devotion, does god make us suffer? It seems quite evil to me, also quite against god's whole image it wants us to buy into.

Discuss.

Sounds like your friend is just giving you the usual rubbish that Christians use when prayer works/ fails. No matter what happens it's always God's will for that to happen. Ridiculous if you ask me

[Nowhere Man]

Originally Posted by rusra02

Satan murdered them, not God. Job became more concerned about himself than with understanding God's purpose. God corrected him: "Should there be any contending with a faultfinder with the Almighty? Let the reprover of God himself answer it." In Job's case, he wisely accepted the correction.

Hardly acceptible if that was me.

Thats like saying I'll just watch your family get killed but don't worry, I'll make amends. Like some Mafia don.