universalism in Islam (testimony, punishment, Torah, gospel, soul)

[TashaN]

Originally Posted by ayani

well, i find that when i pray, Truth, i find clarity and certainty. i feel the same way when i have time to step away from the world and reflect. as i mentioned above, i have emotional ups and downs, and struggle with inner fragmentation and uncertainty. saying "yes" to the existence of One God and connecting to that in salat is a great healer, and it makes sense to me. to "submit" means to bow down before, but also to meet and to face. when i pray, i ask to be rightly guided, to be grateful, and for peace. one must ask if one is to receive, one must recognize and express a hope for something first, if one wants it to become real. so to submit to God is, in part, perhaps to understand that there is One God, and that in coming back to the Tawhid is where we belong.

I agree that Tawhid and the belief in God is the ultimate goal, but do you believe "submition" to be physical, spiritual, or both?

Also, please justify your answer if you don't mind.

[ayani]

Originally Posted by The Truth

I agree that Tawhid and the belief in God is the ultimate goal, but do you believe "submition" to be physical, spiritual, or both?

Also, please justify your answer if you don't mind.

i believe it has to be both physical and spiritual. we are physical, dynamic creatures with bodies, and the ability to control them. when one chooses to hold one's tongue instead of back-bite or argue destructively, that itself is a form of physical submission. for me, physical submission also takes the form of salat, from Quranic commands to specifically pray, prostrate, and bow.

[TashaN]

Thank you so much, ayani. May Allah increase you in knowledge.

[ayani]

salam. i would like to post something from a Facebook note i wrote several days ago. it expounds a bit on my position and on how i view universalism within Islam.

salam aleykum, all

i've gotten a couple questions about my new religious identity displayed on Facebook. (monotheist / hanif)

so God willing i'd like to clarify a few things, for myself and for my friends here.

i dearly love the spirit of Islam, and when i read the Quran, something resonates clearly with me. as humans, many of us tend to seek out "something", that ineffable, desired, immaterial place of certainty and peace. we may transfer from philosophy to philosophy or faith to faith, go through years of struggle and doubt and re-evaluation.

i believe in One God. hence the monotheism. i believe that God is sublime, omni-present, the author of purpose, the sustainer, the living, and the One to whom we will be returned. i believe that God and that our seeking for God is not limited or confined to one creed or religious tradition.

here is what the Quran says :

"and they said: "be Jews or Christians so that you may be guided!" say: "no, rather the creed of Abraham, monotheism; for he was not of those who set up partners." 2:135

"Abraham was neither a Jew nor a Nazarene, but he was a monotheist who submitted; he was not of those who set up partners." 3:68

in the second aya, the word here translated as "monotheist" is "hanif". independent of later ritual and dogmatic additions to this belief in One God is the hanifi deen, simply submission to the One God, and worship / adoration of God alone. the Quran mentions Jews, Christians, Mandaeans, and Zoroastrians as among those who have submitted to God and are rightly guided. hence, Muslims. 2:62 and 22:17

the Quran is refreshingly free of prescribed ritual and law. the urging message is to turn to and seek God, to worship Him, to honor the connection we have with Him, and to submit to Him in piety, humility, and trust.

"and your god is but One god, there is no god but He; the Almighty, the Merciful." 2:163

[fullyveiled muslimah]

I like your assesments about Quran and I think you approach it with a purity of mind that many of us forget to do. Islam itself is both a wide expanse of knowledge and it has a structure and a boundary.

I think I pm'ed you about this subject but never heard any feedback. In any case I feel that Islam encourages the most sensible approach to universalism. Allah has ever and always been extremely consistent with His messege towards mankind. Yeah, the social laws have changed more than a fw times, but the messeges of tawheed, risalat, and akhirat have always been the same. I find that consistency a basis from which the many truths stem. At one point in time, all the religions were for Allah. To every nation has come a warner, so it makes sense that the religion of tawheed was established everywhere these warners were sent. What they turned into,we can see today, but if we look back at the very basic teachings, we can see the universal truths in all of them.

The reason I see Islam as the ultimate truth is because I see that where all other religions have a portion of the truth within them, that it was only in Islam could I find them all together. I appreciate that, and thank Allah for it.

Ayani I am really happy that Allah guided you towards the straight path. May He continue to guide you, me, and all the muslims in the world, and may He open the ways of hidayyat to all mankind, Ameen.

[ayani]

fullyveiled ~

i hear you. this is very much how i feel, as well. i remember one brother saying that "all children are born as Muslims", and that truly struck a chord with me. i remember being very small, before becoming confused / entangled with the dynamics of theology and sectarianism, and having a joyful, clear sense of One, transcendent "something" that was innately intelligent, present, living, and all-powerful. that which i would now call (and call upon as God, as Allah.

Ayani I am really happy that Allah guided you towards the straight path. May He continue to guide you, me, and all the muslims in the world, and may He open the ways of hidayyat to all mankind, Ameen.

ameen sister, isha'allah.

[GabrielWithoutWings]

The OP was very beautiful, so I do believe I'll subscribe.

[fullyveiled muslimah]

hey gabriel,

welcome to the forums. LOL why is the agnosticism depressing?

[GabrielWithoutWings]

Originally Posted by fullyveiled muslimah

hey gabriel,

welcome to the forums. LOL why is the agnosticism depressing?

The thought of not continuing after I die gives me nightmares. All my knowledge, memories, and feelings erased forever... What would be the point of being here in the first place?

So... I'll keep looking until I find the Truth.

Or, until I end up in the nut house.

Whichever comes first.