Saved by Faith alone Christians: The Rapture will occur when? (grace, pray)

[Terrywoodenpic]

I do not believe in the rapture, can you convince me that I should?

[slabbey06]

Originally Posted by wizanda

Pray it's soon for you all!

Not a day goes by that I don't hope it's soon!

[slabbey06]

Originally Posted by Hope

I don't hold to a particular stance on the Rapture. Because, quite honestly, as long as you are walking with the Lord, and expecting His appearing, it shouldn't really matter.

You are not alone in thinking this. I would guess that the majority of Believers today think the same way. However, I don't agree for a number of reasons...

Christ returning for the Church is a major theme throughout the New Testament (John 14:1-3; Titus 2:13; Phil. 3:20; 1 Cor. 1:7; 15:51-53; 1 John 3:1-3; 1 Thess. 4:13-18; etc). If it's important enough for God to have emphasized over and over again, I think it should be a doctrine that matters deeply to us, one that we study and look into.

There are a couple different views on when the Rapture will take place (5 I think). We are commanded to accurately handle the word of truth (1 Tim. 2:15). This means we have the responsibility, and the privilege, of searching the Scriptures to discern, by the power of the Holy Spirit, which view is accurate and fits in the context of the whole Bible. What one believes about the Rapture doesn't just effect how one interprets "Rapture" passages. It effect how one interprets other extremely significant portions of the Bible. For example, is God done with Israel? Is the Church spiritual Israel? Are we in the Tribulation now? Is Revelation literal, allegorical, something that already happened? Can believers experience God's wrath? Will Christ really reign for 1000 years, or is He reigning now spiritually? All these questions in some way or another are effected by the stance one takes on when the Rapture will occur. And what we believe about all these questions will effect how we live our lives.

[Hope]

Originally Posted by slabbey06

You are not alone in thinking this. I would guess that the majority of Believers today think the same way. However, I don't agree for a number of reasons...

Christ returning for the Church is a major theme throughout the New Testament (John 14:1-3; Titus 2:13; Phil. 3:20; 1 Cor. 1:7; 15:51-53; 1 John 3:1-3; 1 Thess. 4:13-18; etc). If it's important enough for God to have emphasized over and over again, I think it should be a doctrine that matters deeply to us, one that we study and look into.

There are a couple different views on when the Rapture will take place (5 I think). We are commanded to accurately handle the word of truth (1 Tim. 2:15). This means we have the responsibility, and the privilege, of searching the Scriptures to discern, by the power of the Holy Spirit, which view is accurate and fits in the context of the whole Bible. What one believes about the Rapture doesn't just effect how one interprets "Rapture" passages. It effect how one interprets other extremely significant portions of the Bible. For example, is God done with Israel? Is the Church spiritual Israel? Are we in the Tribulation now? Is Revelation literal, allegorical, something that already happened? Can believers experience God's wrath? Will Christ really reign for 1000 years, or is He reigning now spiritually? All these questions in some way or another are effected by the stance one takes on when the Rapture will occur. And what we believe about all these questions will effect how we live our lives.

I agree that the rapture is certainly very important. And you are absolutely right. We should study about it, and be discerning, especially in these last days. I think one of the major problems with the church these days is lack of discernment. I could go into another whole tangent on that topic.

However, all that said, the very fact that so many interpretations of the timing of the rapture exist is because the Scriptures are not explicit in this regard. It is definitely a major theme, no doubt, but not one that should be divisive to the church. Because that's mainly what I see. A little camp over here, saying this is how it is, we've got it right, then another camp over here saying, no, you're wrong, this is how it is, etc., etc. And that's distracting us from where our focus should be---simply on Christ.

I've read Revelations several times, and the other Scriptures you pointed out, and have heard various viewpoints, and still haven't come away with the conviction that we can be absolutely certain when the rapture will occur. And I'm always a little bit skittish around folk who think they've got everything down pat about portions of Scripture that aren't explicit. Sometimes people get carried away, and start claiming they know the day and hour of Christ's coming (when Christ Himself said He didn't know), they know who the Anti-Christ is, and all this other stuff that the Bible does not explicitly say. We definitely need to be aware, to be watchful of the signs of the times, to be constantly grounded in His Word, and to look for His appearing, but I think holding too tightly to beliefs about things the Bible is not absolutely clear on can possibly do us more harm than good. Because what if it turns out you are wrong about the timing of the rapture? That could greatly affect your life as well! This is why I hold it lightly. I say ok, Lord, only You know for sure. I'll just keep my eyes on You, keep walking close beside you, and Your Holy Spirit will give me discernment and wisdom at the proper time.

I hope this helps explain why I feel the way I do. But I totally respect the opinions of yourself and others who hold to a certain stance. Who knows? You may be right.

[Reverend Rick]

Originally Posted by joeboonda

Hmmm... Tim LaHaye has some good ones: "Charting the End Times" has lots of colorful illustrations, charts, time-lines etc. real easy to grasp, good for young people, too. His "Revelation Unveiled" is good. Although some find him contorversial, Hal Lindsey wrote a very good one covering many views of the Rapture, etc. and argued well for a pre-trib Rapture in "Vanished Into Thin Air". Those are more 'popular' authors, I have some others, some smaller ones, and there are better books than those I mentioned I'm sure that go even deeper.

Excellent book! Has any of you read the "Left Behind" series by Tim Lahaye and Larry B. Jenkins? The one point I learned was that you can still see heaven even if you miss the rapture.

I believe in the pre-trib theory as well, but could see how the mid-trib way of thinking could happen and would play into the no one knows the hour scripture. The reason I am not a post-tribber is because the whole point of the rapture is to spare the saved person from the 21 judgements that would torment any inhabitant of the earth.

I have to tell you that I fantasize about bringing souls to Christ during that period how ever. It would be so much fun to be able to show folks where the last disaster was predicted and warn them about what is about to happen next.

How many, "I told you so's" would it take before people would finally believe?

[*Paul*]

Originally Posted by Terrywoodenpic

I do not believe in the rapture, can you convince me that I should?

If you believe the words of scripture then you have no reason not to believe in a rapture. It is there as plain as daylight. It is the event when those who are alive at the Lords coming shall be caught up (raptured/ snatched away / harpooned) to meet the Lord in the air, (1 thess 4v14-18) this event is immediatly preceeded by the ressurection of those who are "dead in Christ" to receive their ressurection bodies. This is not to be confused with the general ressurection and great white throne judgement in revelation as that is for all those who are dead (rev 20:11). The ressurection of the dead in Thessalonians and the catching up with them of the living is for those who are in Christ at that time.

Our mortal bodies will not be cast off and left to the dust at this time but will be clothed upon with immortality (2 corinthians 5 2-4) and we shall be like Him(1 John 3:2) our bodies fashioned like unto His glorious ressurection body (phil 3:21).

This event is His appearing - His coming for His bride not to be confused with the second advent when He comes to rule the world with a rod of Iron and the earth shall be filled with the knowledge of the Lord.

[joeboonda]

I just want to say the last several posts have been very good! Slabbey, Hope, Rick, Paul, etc. very good!

Terry, most people do not question whether there will BE a rapture, but more of WHEN it occurs, i.e. before the Tribulation, in the middle, or at the end...and etc. Jesus clearly said He was going to prepare a place for us and that if He did so, He would return to take us there that where He is we may be also. Paul said we will not all die, but the Lord will come back with those who have already died and in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye their bodies will rise and be transformed, then we shall be transformed and all meet Him in the air and will ever be with the Lord. He said to comfort each other with these words. It is what we call the blessed hope of every believer, that we all will not taste death, and that the church will be spared from the hour of wrath or testing (the Tribulation) that is to come upon the whole earth.

While we do not know the day nor hour, we know it is imminent. Jesus said when the fig tree begins to bud, the fig tree being symbolic of Israel, "look up, for your redemption draweth nigh." He and others predicted Israel would be scattered again, which happened in 70 A.D., but that a remnant would remain and they would be a nation again in one day. This happened May 14th, 1948. Since then they have been a leading producer of fruit and flowers, the land budding where it had been desolate for almost 2,000 years, another very precise fulfillment of prophecy. We believe, as we see people travel to and fro like never before, i.e. jumbo jets, automobiles, etc., and knowledge increasing exponentialy, i.e. the web, the information superhighway, as Daniel predicted, that we are living in very close to the last days before the Great Seven Year Tribulation and all the end time events. It is both comforting and sobering, but it is quite scriptural and we can be certain no matter where we place the order of events, Jesus is indeed coming again, haleluia, amen!

[rocka21]

Originally Posted by *Paul*

I hold to a pre millenial view of the second coming and a pre tribulational interpretation of the Lords appearing to us and our being snatched away to be with Him (the rapture) When do you believe the rapture will occur in relation to the tribulation? (If at all)

Pre- trib rapture.


going on the first load!

[Reverend Rick]

And when Christ's word has been heard everywhere in the world to all people, he will return.

With today's technology, we are not far from fulfilling this.