Sad Story, did the man really had said that he has a bomb? (moral, choice)

[Ardent Listener]

Originally Posted by Seyorni

I can fully understand the marshall's reaction to the incident Darkdale clarified so succinctly in post # 15. I'll reserve final judgement, though, till all the facts are in.
Initial reports of this type of incident are notorious for omitting or distorting crucial facts. For example, it appears the suspected bomber was off the plane and nowhere near any other persons at the time he was shot...

Always a idea to reserve judgement until all the facts are known. I was listening to the MIchael Savage show on my way home and Dr. Savage is outraged over this killing. He said that his first reaction was that the marshall did the right thing. Now he is getting reports by fellow passengers who say that the victum never said that he had a bomb. When people were interviewed by the FBI they were asked. "Did you hear the B word?" Dr. Savage was also outraged that the passengers were forced to exit the plane with their hands on their heads. That included a little girl who was crying.

An investigation needs to take place so that all the facts are made known.

[nutshell]

The Marshall did do the right thing and reports have confirmed witnesses said the man said the "B" word. It doesn't matter if he was on the plane or on the jetway. He was a threat and it was right he was shot. I also think it's a good idea passengers left with their hands on their head. Many times, there are accomplices on the plane (9/11, anyone?). We no longer mess around with airport security. This is serious business and we must not hesitate when there is a threat.

[greatcalgarian]

Innocent Death?

I posted a very similar happening in London in August, and the respond to that post is exactly the same as this one. Many will just support the shooting without waiting to find out the details, exactly the same case as in the London case.
For the London situation, the government at the end failed to cover up the wrong action and admitted the mistake and apologize to the victim's family. The reason is that there is a strong support from the victim's original citizenship country.

In this post of shooting of an innocent person in the US, I predict the ending will be completely different. The news will disappear from the US media in less than two weeks.

By the way I hope those who on first instinct jump to the conclusion that, this is sad, but the air marshalls is just doing their job read the London case thoroughly, and search their soul that if the victim is some one you know, your close relative, say your brother, or cousin, would you have jump to the same conclusion?

[greatcalgarian]

Originally Posted by nutshell

The Marshall did do the right thing and reports have confirmed witnesses said the man said the "B" word. It doesn't matter if he was on the plane or on the jetway. He was a threat and it was right he was shot. I also think it's a good idea passengers left with their hands on their head. Many times, there are accomplices on the plane (9/11, anyone?). We no longer mess around with airport security. This is serious business and we must not hesitate when there is a threat.

Not true, there are more witness that said they never hear him saying the "B" word. Check CNN.

[greatcalgarian]

Originally Posted by Ardent Listener

Always a idea to reserve judgement until all the facts are known. I was listening to the MIchael Savage show on my way home and Dr. Savage is outraged over this killing. He said that his first reaction was that the marshall did the right thing. Now he is getting reports by fellow passengers who say that the victum never said that he had a bomb. When people were interviewed by the FBI they were asked. "Did you hear the B word?" Dr. Savage was also outraged that the passengers were forced to exit the plane with their hands on their heads. That included a little girl who was crying.

An investigation needs to take place so that all the facts are made known.

Frubals to you for keeping an open mind.

That should be the right attitude, always read more to find out more facts before jumping to any conclusion.

Those who supported the Air Marshalls' action without thinking further are obviously paranoic towards terrorism.

[greatcalgarian]

Originally Posted by Sunstone

The Federal Air Marshalls have seldom used their weapons, so I don't think anyone can accuse them of being trigger happy. This seems to be an isolated tragedy.

This may become a bad precedent IF the Air Marshalls are truely trigger happy (I am not saying in this case they are), and authority is trying to cover up.

[greatcalgarian]

Originally Posted by michel

The wife could have been an associate, for all that anyone was aware..........
The marshall had no alternative.

Michel, I have a feeling that you are siding with the authority this time, different from your response for the London case?

[greatcalgarian]

Originally Posted by Victor

I stand corrected. I agree with Jensa, Darkdale, and Michel.

~Victor

Wait for more arguement, more facts revealed, before hastily concurring with those three. You might find yourself having to reverse your stand again.

[greatcalgarian]

<H3>Questions about bomb threat

Investigators are trying to piece together the final moments before the shooting as questions are rising about whether Alpizar made a bomb threat.

The marshals say Alpizar announced he was carrying a bomb before being killed.

However, no other witness has publicly concurred with that account. Only one passenger recalled Alpizar saying, "I've got to get off, I've got to get off," CNN's Kathleen Koch reported.

No explosives were found onboard the aircraft. It was the first time a federal air marshal fired a weapon at someone since the program was bolstered after the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks.

Dave Adams, a spokesman for the Federal Air Marshal Service, said Alpizar had run up and down the plane's aisle yelling, "I have a bomb in my bag."

Adams said Alpizar then fled the aircraft and marshals confronted him on the boarding bridge.

"They asked the gentleman, 'Drop your bag, drop your bag. Come to the ground. I'm a federal law enforcement officer. Police. Drop your bag,'" Adams told CNN.

"He failed to comply with their commands, continued approaching the air marshals claiming he had a bomb in his bag. And then they ordered him again down to the ground. He didn't."

The marshals fired two or three shots when Alpizar appeared to reach into his bag, Adams said.

</H3>Only Adams the spoke person announced that "Alpizar had run up and down the plane's aisle yelling, "I have a bomb in my bag.""
Note 1: Adams was not on the plane, he was not a first hand witness.
Note 2: The only witness or witnesses that collaborated with that statement are the two Air Marshall that shot dead Alpizar, who have been 'suspended' and most probably not allow to speak to the press
Note 3: CNN reported that "However, no other witness has publicly concurred with that account. Only one passenger recalled Alpizar saying, "I've got to get off, I've got to get off," CNN's Kathleen Koch reported."

So be your own judge and make your own conclusion whether the "B" word was spoken or not.

Of course, if the topics got heated up, you may find that some passengers on the plane suddenly 'remember' hearing the "B" word especially after the Whitehouse makes her stand:

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- One day after a federal air marshals shot and killed an unarmed airplane passenger in Miami, Florida, the White House defended the marshals' actions.

And we all know when White House made a stand, after sometime, the stand will start to quiver, and in a few weeks time, that stand may be modified, like Rice correcting the "Torture at foreign countries" case.

[greatcalgarian]

From the Washington Post:

On a Delta Air Lines flight in 2002, an air marshal detained a passenger on board who did not comply with security rules and pointed a gun at the passengers for 30 minutes before the flight landed. Authorities said later that the marshal acted properly, but one passenger who was briefly detained though never charged sued and received a $50,000 settlement and an apology from the government. In several other cases, federal air marshals have tackled suspects being pursued by police.