Is file sharing stealing? (beliefs, mission, point of view, devil)

[Fluffy]

Hah $10??? Eurgh the prices in England are disgusting in that case. In my innocence I remember trying to order CDs from America because they were so much cheaper. The package was stopped at customs and I had to pay an extra amount so that they cost the same amount as if I bought them over here. That is just money grabbing, plain and simple.

[Riven]

Well, last time I bought a CD it was $10, anyway. Let me check Best Buy real quick to make sure.


Faith Hill, Fireflies - $9.99
Blindside, The Great Depression - $9.99


So, yeah, $10.

[michel]

Forum Rules10.) Discussion of illegal activities such as software and music piracy and other intellectual property violations are not allowed.

[Crystallas]

I love how 2 major groups are masters are creating things which alter society better than anyone else(MPAA,RIAA.) Marketting skills second to none, and knowledge to convince people anything is right has been heavily overlooked for decades. The most acceptable form of brainwashing in the world.

Do you think that they want to lose control of being able to do this? Downloading indie/shareware/choice/freedom ect really isnt part of their motto. Why should you download entertainment thats free and maybe even educational for nothing, when you can pay to listen to something that you didn't like until you submitted to it after hearing it 200 times. Also I didn't notice many box office movies losing money now. Before the VCR, movies took hits like no other and maybe a handful of films that year were lucky to bring in any money. MPAA may like it or not, but they're stupid if they want to bite the hand that feeds them(in a sence.)

Once libraries are closed, broadcast TV is shut down, and air radio is abandoned, then I'll consider this stealing intelectual property. But up until then, I view this as forcing people to aquire taste in whichever directions these companies feel to be most profitable. If they can afford to spend how many billions on "Stoping such a non-crime!" then they definately aren't phased by the people who compile collections deeper than your average walmart release section.
It's all about choice to see and hear what I want artistically, freedom to like what I like, and freedom for artists to participate.

Until its illegal, and not just "Judge X's verdict which was specified to a certain situation was bought out by one of the richest orginizations ever" then I don't believe that I've talked about anything illegal. Atleast in the US its still not illegal, I know this pretty well since I participate in CopyNight(http://www.copynight.org/), Im very active with my local and federal representatives about digital rights law-making. Including HR104 which was the closest to making anything illegal in the US. Dont let MS and whatever big name or orginization fool you into thinking its illegal, or fool you into thinking that its hurting them soo much to get all of this free advertisement via word of mouth and demonstration. As long as people have holes burning in their pockets, they will buy everything they want...even DukeNukem3D, The Matrix, Shrek 2, and Metalica Black Album(Which are all some of the highest grossing products ever, but also the most downloaded.) I don't see an over-abundance of people saving their hard earned money.
Society is going to do what it wants, and even the best marketted sounrces in the world wont be able to control it. May aswell adapt to the changes in society MPAA and RIAA, instead of fighting it. You'll make more money this way anyhow.

[AtheistAJ]

The main question "Is fileshare stealing", it shouldn't be even in capitalism, but some countries consider it so. As far as I am concerned anyone can take anything from me if they need it. This is one of the points where I agree fully with Christian philosophy, be not selfish. If everything was free and everyone worked for that it would be a perfectly productive world.

[Popeyesays]

I can share any file with anyone if it is my own creation, or it is material in the public domain. If someone else wrote it, composed, authored, published it it is a matter of their ownership. To share it violates that ownership. One buys a tape or a CD with the express obligation in writing that it will not be illegally duplicated and "shared".

If you believe that Harry Potter is the intellectual creation of the author, and the specific property of the publisher how can you duplicate and distribute it yourself and NOT be a thief?

Regards,
Scott

[robtex]

MOD POST:

So far so good. Please do not post any url's to file sharing on this thread and don't give instructions on how to exchange files. Yall can debate and discuss the morality and legality of it but since it is a copyright infringement I ask that you do not discuss how to use filesharing or link sites that do to this thread. Thank you guys for not doing so up until this point.

[michel]

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

I can share any file with anyone if it is my own creation, or it is material in the public domain. If someone else wrote it, composed, authored, published it it is a matter of their ownership. To share it violates that ownership. One buys a tape or a CD with the express obligation in writing that it will not be illegally duplicated and "shared".

If you believe that Harry Potter is the intellectual creation of the author, and the specific property of the publisher how can you duplicate and distribute it yourself and NOT be a thief?

Regards,
Scott

Nice point, Scott.

Basically, Fluffy, if someone creates a computer program, and publishes it as 'shareware', he is telling anyone that they may pass it around (although it will usually stipulate that it must not be altered in any way, and that the credit of having written the program should be recognised as being his).

Otherwise, the material is copyright. there is no way around it.

[Fluffy]

Nice point, Scott.

Basically, Fluffy, if someone creates a computer program, and publishes it as 'shareware', he is telling anyone that they may pass it around (although it will usually stipulate that it must not be altered in any way, and that the credit of having written the program should be recognised as being his).

Otherwise, the material is copyright. there is no way around it.[img]images/smilies/wink.gif[/img]

I fully agree with this. I just disagree that file sharing is stealing because there is no passage of physical goods, there is no loss on the part of the party who provided the file for copying and there is a duplication of information (not a copy from one area to another). These 3 things convince me that file sharing cannot be stealing since stealing implies all 3 of these things.

Whether it is immoral or not is a different matter. However, I would like to point out that file sharing is not illegal. File sharing of copyrighted files is, on the other hand, so perhaps it would be more appropriate for the mods to allow descriptions of how the process of file sharing happens since this has plenty of legal applications.