Torture Monkey stands firm (choice, America, Article)

[MidnightBlue]

Originally Posted by Starfish

You know--every president to date has had his critics. No exceptions.

Rarely has the criticism been so thoroughly deserved, though. If anything, Bush has been criticized far less than he deserves.

Originally Posted by Starfish

And so far, as far as I know, they've all (?) been Christian, more or less. So it's easy to generalize and blame their mistakes and judgements on Christianity.

Sure. Because it's not just that the presidents have been Christians, but that the voters have been mostly Christians, and that there's never been any shortage of preachers, priests and ministers to endorse government policies. When I think of Spelly blessing the bombs during the Vietnam War, it makes me sick.

Originally Posted by Starfish

But on the other side, this country has been pretty darn great for over two centuries. Should we credit that to Christian leadership?--maybe, I don't know.

When you say this country has been pretty darn great, what do you have in mind? Slavery? The genocide of Native Americans? Jim Crow laws? Punitive laws against homosexuality? McCarthyism? It's always been a pretty good place to be a white heterosexual Christian, but it's been pretty rough on people who don't fit that mold.

[MysticSang'ha]

Originally Posted by rheff78

lol, my bad. Talk about a lack of info huh? oh well, what's the difference though, honestly?

Oh, my Buddha.....




Peace,
Mystic

[Starfish]

Originally Posted by MidnightBlue

When you say this country has been pretty darn great, what do you have in mind? Slavery? The genocide of Native Americans? Jim Crow laws? Punitive laws against homosexuality? McCarthyism? It's always been a pretty good place to be a white heterosexual Christian, but it's been pretty rough on people who don't fit that mold.

Then why do so many risk everything to get here, one way or another?

[MidnightBlue]

Originally Posted by Starfish

Then why do so many risk everything to get here, one way or another?

I didn't say it was the worst place in the world. But if you had been a queer at practically any time in our history, or a black person in 1920 (or 1960), or a Cherokee in 1840, or a Lakota in 1890, or even a Mormon in 1845, you might have had a very different view of just how darn great this country has been.

[Starfish]

Originally Posted by MidnightBlue

I didn't say it was the worst place in the world. But if you had been a queer at practically any time in our history, or a black person in 1920 (or 1960), or a Cherokee in 1840, or a Lakota in 1890, or even a Mormon in 1845, you might have had a very different view of just how darn great this country has been.

That's where we'll have to disagree. I love this country. It's not perfect, but a whole lot better than most. I believe those men who set it up were divinely inspired. The constitution was inspired. I'm grateful to be a citizen. As long we're all striving to uphold the consititution, in our different ways, according to our conscience, then may it continue on for many more generations.

[Autodidact]

Originally Posted by Starfish

You know--every president to date has had his critics. No exceptions. And so far, as far as I know, they've all (?) been Christian, more or less. So it's easy to generalize and blame their mistakes and judgements on Christianity. But on the other side, this country has been pretty darn great for over two centuries. Should we credit that to Christian leadership?--maybe, I don't know.

But generalizations are awfully convenient.

To whom is this post addressed?

[Autodidact]

Originally Posted by Starfish

How do the Japanese or Germans feel about the U.S.? (Do we have any in the RF group?) I've heard the Iraqis think quite highly of us.

You've heard wrong.
How would you feel if Iraq invaded the U.S. and occupied us for 5 years without even providing working electricity?

[Autodidact]

Originally Posted by rheff78

I would have to say they are not necessarily thanking their lucky stars. Especially the Japanese. They live in a country where there is limited space. They are limited to the amount of children they can have. They are forced to abort if they are having a girl. Some girls are even neutered so they cannot concieve. That doesn't really sound like they are living the "good" life.

Well, according to this poll they're significantly happier than we are.

[Autodidact]