The HIV immigration ban is a good thing. (America, POV)

[Green Gaia]

Originally Posted by Ciscokid

It has nothing to do with where people are born.

Of course it does. That's how citizenship is determined.

[Quoth The Raven]

Originally Posted by Ryan2065

Hrm... Here is a list of diseases that can keep you out of America!
http://www.uscis.gov/graphics/medical_exam.htm

Oh no, those horrible Americans who keep all HIV positive people out and have given them no way to get it! Oh me oh my!

Er, wait... No... they keep most people with STD's out of the country... Then again you can always fill out the waiver. =)

Yay for the slippery slope argument! Tried and true since post 5!

And what if the FBI did huge background checks on us, similar to the ones they give immigrants? Ah, what the hell... forget the background checks and medical tests immigrants get! We don't need that sort of thing. Any immigrant seeking US citizenship should just get all the laws and rights that Americans get right off the bat!

The operative word there being list of diseases that CAN keep you out. The fact remains that the only one mentioned specifically in the legislation is HIV. The rest are open to the discrection of the man on the ground at the time. Why should a disease that isn't that contagious be given a special mention IN A LAW? I'm speaking specifically as regards to non immigrants in this case. You've got a bit of a cough and customs while rummaging through your luggage finds some antibiotics, that'll more tha likely be overlooked, despite the fact that there's the chance you've got TB. You look healthy as a horse and they tumble some HIV meds amongst your clothes, you're on the next plane home. The first is far more contagious than the second, and you're trying to say this is for protection of US citizens and not some sort of discrimination?
As to slippery slopes, I'll leave them to the playground. I'd just like to know if there are people so delusional as to believe keeping people with a disease that's already inside the country out of it is going to achieve anything with regard to limiting contagion.
And I guess you answered the bit about enforced testing of citizens being a violation of civil liberties nicely, in your own delightfully roundabout way.

[Ciscokid]

Originally Posted by Maize

Of course it does. That's how citizenship is determined.

No I mean denying people access to our country shouldn't have anything to do with their birthplace. That isn't to say that there aren't other factors but birthplace isn't one of them.

[MidnightBlue]

Originally Posted by Ciscokid

I would also like to point out the fundamental difference I see between liberals and conservatives. Liberals make it sound like it's their duty to make sure that EVERYONE else has what they want, get rid of restrictions and let people do as they wish....at the expense of the people.

No. Liberals don't believe in making sure everyone has everything they want, but they do believe everyone should have what they need. Conservativesbelieve that existing power structures and the existing privileges of a select group of people must be preserved at all costs. Neoconservatives believe those power structures and privileges should be extended by the use of force. Religious conservatives believe that they have a divine mandate to impose their particular brand of mumbo-jumbo on everyone else.

Originally Posted by Ryan2065

Hrm... Here is a list of diseases that can keep you out of America!
http://www.uscis.gov/graphics/medical_exam.htm

That list explains HHS regulations, so it doesn't contradict what QTR said.

All else being equal, it would seem very odd that HIV, which isn't highly contagious, should be covered by law, while TB, which is, is left up to HHS regulations. That distinction is easily explained by the unfortunate political climate of the U.S. and the fact that HIV is perceived a disease of queers and colored people -- i.e., people whom conservatives consider undesirables in the first place.

[Quoth The Raven]

Originally Posted by MidnightBlue

All else being equal, it would seem very odd that HIV, which isn't highly contagious, should be covered by law, while TB, which is, is left up to HHS regulations. That distinction is easily explained by the unfortunate political climate of the U.S. and the fact that HIV is perceived a disease of queers and colored people -- i.e., people whom conservatives consider undesirables in the first place.

As I read it, it was an amendment to a bill that involved a lot of positive things such as funding for research into HIV, etc. and it was either veto this and scotch the good stuff with it, or enshrine in law the stupidity that a disease with limited communicability is the Reaper in viral form. Apparently the latter was considered the lesser of the evils.

[Booko]

Originally Posted by Quoth_The _Raven

HIV is the only infectious disease actually named in the relevent legislation...anything else is left up to public health experts working for the HHS to make a call on.
When you've got cretins with MDRTB who have to have someone come to their home on a daily basis to nanny them through something as simple as seeing a course of antibiotics through to the end living in your country, why the hell is something that's so much harder to catch a thing that needs to be singled out?

Because a ban on HIV keeps out gays and darkies, m'dear.

You know, like "No Irish need apply."

[Quoth The Raven]

Originally Posted by Booko

Because a ban on HIV keeps out gays and darkies, m'dear.

You know, like "No Irish need apply."

Of course, what was I thinking.
'Sign, sign, everywhere a sign...'

[Ciscokid]

Originally Posted by MidnightBlue

No. Liberals don't believe in making sure everyone has everything they want, but they do believe everyone should have what they need. Conservativesbelieve that existing power structures and the existing privileges of a select group of people must be preserved at all costs. Neoconservatives believe those power structures and privileges should be extended by the use of force. Religious conservatives believe that they have a divine mandate to impose their particular brand of mumbo-jumbo on everyone else.

And as a conservative I