Do Atheists believe in free-will?

[waitasec]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

There was no energy. It's called nothingness.
The smartest people in the world cannot breach the concept. And I'm saying literally. Stephen Hawking types.

how do you presume to KNOW this?

if anything science says we know more about what we don't know...
so i'm quite skeptical of your knowledge...of the unknown...

you never answered my question...
do you claim the universe is sentient?

cause does not mean intent...
for example:
is it the will of the color blue and the color yellow to turn into the color green when mixed?
blue is a cause just as yellow is...without intent to make the color green

[Sum1sGruj]

how do you presume to KNOW this?

For the same reason people KNOW that free will doesn't exist
But with a better grasp of reality.

Really, I just completed the argument that throws up the idea that we have no free will, and it turned out that we do have free will:

If reality resulted from nothing, then it did something of it's own accord. Since we are literally of that reality, we to are able to do things of our own accord.
In fact, it could be safe to say that we literally invoked the universe ourselves since we are reality.
Therefore, cause and effect can co-exist with free will. In fact, they are a duality.

It's either that or God, really.

[waitasec]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

For the same reason people KNOW that free will doesn't exist
But with a better grasp of reality.

who said that?
reality says no one claims to KNOW anything...this is entirely speculative...it can only be speculative until evidence is presented.
please understand it's that some arguments make more sense than others...
until then we, our individual selves, will follow where there is more logic based on the principle of reason...

the only way a person grows or learns anything is when they know their limitations, which is a humbling place to be. otherwise, they keep going in circles...

[waitasec]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

[i]If reality resulted from nothing, then it did something of it's own accord.

but how do you know reality resulted from nothing....?

[Sum1sGruj]

Originally Posted by waitasec

but how do you know reality resulted from nothing....?

What else did it result from?

You can't really throw up that it can't be observed, and so cannot be proven. One cannot observe 'nothingness'.
We could say that our universe spawned from M-theory conceptions of dimensional strings and branes colliding, but where did they come from? We could think of a tenth dimensional singularity (that we theoretically are inside of).. where did it come from?

At the bottom of it all, there is nothing. Which holds up my claims very well.

Besides the fact that God created it

[jarofthoughts]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

And the person doesn't realize or pretends not to realize that Newtononian/quantum states are completely irrelevant and that zero point/vacuum energy was actually two indirect things I was speaking of. There was no energy. It's called nothingness, not even so much as a dimensional plane.

You used the old misconception of the 'first cause' based in Newtonian physics, which, as I explained, is irrelevant when dealing with Quantum states.
And the Universe, at least according to many Physicists and Cosmologists, began as exactly that.
In other words: The 'first cause' argument is invalid.

[Sum1sGruj]

Originally Posted by jarofthoughts

You used the old misconception of the 'first cause' based in Newtonian physics, which, as I explained, is irrelevant when dealing with Quantum states.
And the Universe, at least according to many Physicists and Cosmologists, began as exactly that.
In other words: The 'first cause' argument is invalid.

There is even cause at the quantum level. At the beginning, there was the quantum (which is the 10th dimensional singularity to any believe was a quantum). It had to have existed of it's own accord.
I understand it is a hard pill to swallow. In fact, if one dwells on it long enough, it could crack their sanity.
Is it the ultimate paradox, or was it simply God?

[waitasec]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

What else did it result from?

this is where i say, i don't know...no one knows and if anyone claims to know, doesn't... edit:without providing evidence
would you consider this question comes from faith?

You can't really throw up that it can't be observed, and so cannot be proven. One cannot observe 'nothingness'.
We could say that our universe spawned from M-theory conceptions of dimensional strings and branes colliding, but where did they come from? We could think of a tenth dimensional singularity (that we theoretically are inside of).. where did it come from?

have you ever considered that we are born without the senses required to fully observe?
for instance;
an ant isn't aware of our presence unless it senses vibration

At the bottom of it all, there is nothing. Which holds up my claims very well.

Besides the fact that God created it

that is a faith based claim...which ultimately doesn't contribute to the exploration...so if you are happy with that, then so be it.

[Sum1sGruj]

Originally Posted by waitasec

that is a faith based claim...which ultimately doesn't contribute to the exploration...so if you are happy with that, then so be it.

Well that's the irony of it all isn't it? In my opinion, 'nothing' can be observed simply by acknowledging that it is 'nothing'. There are no properties in it that warrant anything.

So for me, it's not so much faith as it is reality, and faith is only in my God being the divine maker instead of another.
Many don't acknowledge it because it isn't science. But that doesn't mean precisely anything. In fact, it proves divinity in my opinion. Science cannot venture on divinity, and it just so happens that science will never find out where reality came from. Sits pretty well in my book.

[waitasec]

Originally Posted by Sum1sGruj

Well that's the irony of it all isn't it? In my opinion, 'nothing' can be observed simply by acknowledging that it is 'nothing'. There are no properties in it that warrant anything.

So for me, it's not so much faith as it is reality, and faith is only in my God being the divine maker instead of another.

so why do you object exploration?