New creed of Cathari (Jesus Christ, ritual, beliefs, soul, grace)

[TripleHelix]

I have been studying many of the religions of this world and the one I loved most was the ways of the Cathari. I disagree with some of these beliefs, but agree with some of them, so I was thinking about starting a new sect.
I tried this long ago, with the Carthadox, but many things have changed since then.
I was wondering, would anyone be interested, or if not at least help me think of a name.

My personal beliefs and that of the Cathari that i agree with:
Jesus is the Savior
The world is evil, but only after it killed Jesus Christ
Abortion is evil, it stops a soul that can be taught the right way of life from living
Most religions are misled, or are tainted by the false god, Satan (The Fallen Lord) and they should be converted, or if not at least enlighten them
Cathari will live like Cathari should, unlike Christians who say they are Christians and break all of the Commandmants. Basically, live like you preach

I will add more, post any questions, comments or flame me. i don't care

[The Black Whirlwind]

does your religion relate to the cathars that were massacred in a papal crusade, or is this just a brand new name?

[Halcyon]

Originally Posted by Fat Kat Matt

does your religion relate to the cathars that were massacred in a papal crusade, or is this just a brand new name?

Um, i reitterate matt's question.
As a Gnostic i welcome anyone onto what i consider the right path, however your version does seem different to the ancient Cathars, would you mind expanding? Might help us come up with that name too.

[TripleHelix]

no, it relates loosely to the religion that the Albegensians (The ones who were wiped out) and the Cathari religon as a whole is just like Christianity, it has it's many forms..
Waldenses
Bogomils
Manicheanes
Albigenses
Mine is just based on the Cathari religion, mostly. Some of their beliefs were odd...

[TripleHelix]

Oh, on expanding:
I believe that Jesus Christ is the Savior, though the Lord sent him as more of an icon, he is the savior as said but it was mainly a test to mankind (which they failed)
I believe that the right path (Cathari, Gnosticsm) should be more dominant, and arise from the ashes of persecution.
I believe that most, if not all religions are influeced by the Fallen One (Satan) and their beliefs should be corrected
I believe that Satan is winning the war right now (more churches are becoming corrupt)

[Halcyon]

Originally Posted by TripleHelix

no, it relates loosely to the religion that the Albegensians (The ones who were wiped out) and the Cathari religon as a whole is just like Christianity, it has it's many forms..
Waldenses
Bogomils
Manicheanes
Albigenses
Mine is just based on the Cathari religion, mostly. Some of their beliefs were odd...

Oh, on expanding:
I believe that Jesus Christ is the Savior, though the Lord sent him as more of an icon, he is the savior as said but it was mainly a test to mankind (which they failed)
I believe that the right path (Cathari, Gnosticsm) should be more dominant, and arise from the ashes of persecution.
I believe that most, if not all religions are influeced by the Fallen One (Satan) and their beliefs should be corrected
I believe that Satan is winning the war right now (more churches are becoming corrupt)

I wouldn't say that the Gnostic sects you mention are much like Christianity and its denominations, each are religions in their own rights, especially Manichaenism. Cathari was a blanket term to cover many different Gnostic paths, so when you say "mine is based on te Cathari religion, mostly..." are you referring to the now (practically) extinct Catharism of southern France?

As for the explaination of your beliefs, i'd suggest although the term was indeed used by the ancient Cathars, the use of 'satan' to describe Yaldaboath is not totally correct. The satan of the bible was a term of office, a position created by the demiurge, an Archon, the idea of the satan as being Lucifer and/or the devil is not of the bible, he was an adversary - someone who would make Yaldaboath look good. (as an aside, the demiurge didn't 'fall from grace', he was born flawed, something he couldn't help).
Other than that i have a couple of questions, what is your view of Jesus, you've given a short explaination, but i wouldn't mind an expansion - do you see him as the logos embodied? Or as a dual being, the man Jesus and the Christ separate? Or do you see him as an entirely spiritual being giving the illusion of physical form? All of these beliefs were held by various Gnostic sects. Or do you have your own opinion?

Why do you think Gnosticism should be more dominant? Our forefathers went to Catholic churches, they took part in pagan and Catholic festivals, but they keep their own beliefs how they should be - strictly personal. Gnosticism isn't about power or 'being right', its about Gnosis, the finding of God. Or do you disagree?

Why do you think other religions should be corrected? What makes you think they haven't already been so? God and the Aeons of the pleroma are far superior to the demiurge, if you look hard enough you will find their influences in most if not all religions, take the God Brahman from the Hindu religion for instance. Or Tara, if she isn't Sophia i'll eat my hat.

I believe that Satan is winning the war right now (more churches are becoming corrupt)

This sentance makes little sense to me, it seems you may be confusing Zoroastrian and Catholic mythology with the beliefs of the ancient Gnostics, or Cathari. What is this war you speak of? The One is beyond war. The demiurge could never win any war, this may be his universe, but all is contained within The One, this world and the demiurge included. Also, how can churches become more corrupt? They already worship a false god, how much more corrupt can you get?

Are you sure Gnosticism or Catharism really correlate with your personal beliefs? To me it sounds more like you're a Pauline Christian with the death cult aspects removed. Then again, maybe i just need a more detailed explaination of what you actually do believe.

[Mike182]

Originally Posted by TripleHelix

I believe that Satan is winning the war right now (more churches are becoming corrupt)

i have listend to your posts about your beliefs, and this is the only part i have to make a noise about



where is your evidence for this?