Why Heathenism? (ritual, moral, Earth, salvation, tradition)

Darkdale · #1 11-17-2005, 09:17 AM

The other day, someone told me that my religious views take all the power and meaning out of religion. With no salvation, no eternal life, no all-powerful God, no real divine wisdom and no ultimate Truth; why not just be an atheist? In the end, what does my form of religion offer that a mere agnostic philosophy doesn’t?

The answer to that last question is obvious. It includes a religious world view, with gods, a mythology and everything. Look, the difference between superstition and faith is the amount of freedom one has in developing a set of beliefs in accordance with experience. I’m not trying to take the meaning out of religion. I’m just trying to remove all these unnecessary attachments to ideals and philosophies that leave no physical residue on reality.

“Well then”, the atheist asks, “aren’t the gods an unnecessary ideal? If you are going to be honest with yourself, you haven’t ever seen these gods have you? You have faith that they exist or, excuse me, you have a superstition that they exist.”

Well, yes and no. Yes I have a superstitious belief in gods, but I do so because I believe that there is something truly, literally divine about Life and I am so affected by the vivacity of this feeling that I cannot help but assign gods and goddesses to the power and mystery inherent in the essence of life itself. Now, are gods a necessary belief? I suppose not, but that is what I do with the awe and inspiration I receive from my observation of the world. I suppose gods and as long as my worship of them produces the effect of focusing that awe and inspiration, I’m going to keep supposing their existence and I’m going to keep worshipping them. Is that really so crazy? Maybe, but who cares?

My religion reflects my worldview and my worldview is dependant upon my experience of Nature and Nature (mainly the existence of life in nature) is so magnificent and awe inspiring that I can’t help thinking that there is something divine at work. Now I only haphazardly understand what that means, but here are my choices (and they are choices):

First, to believe that there is no divinity in the universe; that is to ascribe no divine aspect to the material that exists. Well, OK, but that seems not to reflect my experience. I feel as though there is a divinity ascribed to, apart of or within the material that exists, though not outside of it.

Second, I can place absolute faith in my idea of the nature of that divinity; but really, all I’m working from is a feeling. I don’t really have any knowledge other than my feeling that there is something divine in the material of the universe, especially with regard to life. I can’t say that the way I imagine it to be is the truth, so I can’t really place absolute or even partial faith in the Reality of my imagined image of the divine (the Norse Gods).

Third, I can choose to imagine divinity in such a way that makes sense to me and as illustrated in the mythologies that developed from a world view I hold, admire and adore (Heathenism). Well, this third choice seems to make the most sense to me.

Then how can you lecture anyone else about the nature of their own religions? Well, I’m not really interested in the nature of people’s religions, as much as I am interested in the nature of the worldview upon which their religions are founded. The worldviews we hold shape the cultures, governments and activities of our societies and as a member of an increasingly global society, I have a vested interest in seeing the world move toward a view that most closely reflects Nature. Why? Because deviating from the lessons of Nature results in ignorance and ineptitude. Idealism exhausts us, because it is a pursuit of, or worship of something that contradicts our daily experience. A bad worldview makes for a bad world and I want to live in the most exciting, thriving, vigorous and progressive world as is humanly possible.

So, I take an interest. I say, come back down to earth. What are we doing with all these ideals of perfection and perfect gods? What are we doing to ourselves by condemning our nature as sinful and evil? What are we thinking when we harm nature, destroying species…mucking up our water, our soil and our air? What are we thinking when we kill each other out of sheer pretentiousness, out of utter intolerance for the beliefs of others? Why are we spending so much time worrying about what happens after life and why are we ignoring the quality of life that Mankind is living now? Why are men so paranoid and afraid? Why are we becoming increasingly incompetent? Why are we becoming increasingly dependant on institutions? Why are virtues becoming desperately vacant in the world? Why is family becoming progressively more insignificant? What happened to self-discipline? Why are we becoming gradually weaker with every generation? Why are we becoming increasingly obese?

Well, because the worldview our societies are built upon are vacuous. They offer no practical wisdom, no erudite vision for our future and offer little to no standard for moral behavior. So, we struggle and we suffer because the food of the 21st century is fear, ignorance and fragility (sensitivity). Read the Norse mythologies and I think you’ll fall as madly in love with the worldview as I have. I think your heart will rejoice in a worldview that praises strength, courage, discipline and honor. I think your heart will celebrate the importance of family and community, of good health and good manners, of virtue and intense purpose. I think all our hearts long for these things; and that is what Heathenism offers. From that worldview came the myths and in the myths we see our idea of the gods and in the gods we see the best within ourselves. What could be more religious than that?

Storm Moon · #2 12-02-2005, 03:05 AM

Wow very great read. This may be out of subject slightly, but most of the Eastern religions are like this minus the deities (maybe with the exception of Shinto). I've always felt that there was something divine at work in nature but I never attached any gods/goddesses into it. I don't see anything more religious than personal reflection and looking at ourselves before we look at others. Again, great read.

jeffrey · #3 12-02-2005, 03:45 AM

If your comfortable with it, that's all that matters. If you find it gives you peace of mind, may peace be with you. You don't need to justify your religion to anyone. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad you shared your views, but for the sake of knowledge, so people like myself can learn and understand.

michel · #4 12-02-2005, 04:52 AM

Quote:

The other day, someone told me that my religious views take all the power and meaning out of religion. With no salvation, no eternal life, no all-powerful God, no real divine wisdom and no ultimate Truth; why not just be an atheist?

I would take that person off my Christmas card list, in your shoes. Very Judgemental.

Darkdale · #5 12-02-2005, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michel

I would take that person off my Christmas card list, in your shoes. Very Judgemental.

Well, most of those comments come from my folks or grandfolks or best friends.

So, they stay on the list. I guess people have different reasons for being religious. Basically, I think, it goes back to those different worldviews.

Darkdale · #6 12-26-2005, 10:59 PM

The following is from a post on another board about Asatru and its' relationship to "religion" and "spirituality". This is kind of a summery of where my focus is, from my point of view.. -----------------

I don't know if most people see heathenry the same as me or not, but for me, the gods (with whom I have no personal relationship but tend toward honoring them through ritual) aren't the purpose of my "religion" or the focus of my "spirituality". From what I've gathered from the lore (mainly the Sagas), to be a heathen is to act, to both enjoy and be a boon to friends and family, and finally to live a productive and virtuous life. I have a hard time getting in touch with the old "culture" outside of a literary and historical appreciation, and for the worldview that inspired it. I'm not so much for brawn and adventure as I am for reading, study and debate. But I believe that the foundations of the old heathen cultures have never been needed more than they are today. Honor.

I often find myself trying to figure out what Asatru is doing. All these various organizations, the debates, the reconstruction. I find, more and more, that my interests and actions would not have won much honor in the old days and I struggle with the feelings that arise from that observation. But I realize that I do not live in the old days, nor do I face the same obstacles and environment. I live in the sprawling suburbs of Washington DC, amidst the hustle and bustle of American Capitalism and rabid consumerism. I am a student and have won most of my praise in my works of philosophy and psychology.

What I've learned from trying to live a heathen life is the importance of virtue, of honor and of oaths, the amazing depths and wonders of family and friendship, the simple clarity and Truth of the heathen philosophy and the beatitude of adoring my gods and my ancestors; their mythology and traditions. The language I use to describe this (religion/spirituality/philosophy/worldview) are meaningless compared to actually experiencing them. I'd rather read the sagas than try to explain the religious undertones to others. I'd rather read the Eddas over morning coffee than try to explain the "religious symbolism". I'd rather visit with family and friends than attempt to extrapolate, for the benefit of others, a serious set of semantics capable of defining my traditions. I suppose it is what I’ve learned from my experience that is my religion, if it really needs to be called that at all.

#7 12-27-2005, 09:29 AM

Why not just be an atheist? This atheist understands. What you said makes sense, especialy the part about fear, ignorance and sensitivity, it struck a chord in me.

Darkdale · #8 12-27-2005, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Majikthise

Why not just be an atheist? This atheist understands. What you said makes sense, especialy the part about fear, ignorance and sensitivity, it struck a chord in me.

Heathenism isn't much different than atheism, minus the gods.

Heathens don't try to become all enlightened and spiritual. We are too busy with our family, our friends, our land (if we have it), our work and our lives. Most religions are too far out, require too much abstract time and what is worst, is that they aren't relevant.

Heathenism is a religion, but we don't have any of those gods that are so small that they need us. They have their business, we have ours. It works.

gnomon · #9 12-27-2005, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkdale

....

So, I take an interest. I say, come back down to earth. What are we doing with all these ideals of perfection and perfect gods? What are we doing to ourselves by condemning our nature as sinful and evil? What are we thinking when we harm nature, destroying species…mucking up our water, our soil and our air? What are we thinking when we kill each other out of sheer pretentiousness, out of utter intolerance for the beliefs of others? Why are we spending so much time worrying about what happens after life and why are we ignoring the quality of life that Mankind is living now? Why are men so paranoid and afraid? Why are we becoming increasingly incompetent? Why are we becoming increasingly dependant on institutions? Why are virtues becoming desperately vacant in the world? Why is family becoming progressively more insignificant? What happened to self-discipline? Why are we becoming gradually weaker with every generation? Why are we becoming increasingly obese?

Well, because the worldview our societies are built upon are vacuous. They offer no practical wisdom, no erudite vision for our future and offer little to no standard for moral behavior. So, we struggle and we suffer because the food of the 21st century is fear, ignorance and fragility (sensitivity). Read the Norse mythologies and I think you’ll fall as madly in love with the worldview as I have. I think your heart will rejoice in a worldview that praises strength, courage, discipline and honor. I think your heart will celebrate the importance of family and community, of good health and good manners, of virtue and intense purpose. I think all our hearts long for these things; and that is what Heathenism offers. From that worldview came the myths and in the myths we see our idea of the gods and in the gods we see the best within ourselves. What could be more religious than that?

To be perfectly honest, these last two paragraphs express just as much disdain towards other people worldviews as you claim to avoid. Actually it sounds like the same argument I hear from any other religiously oriented person trying to recruit me. Spare me the tired argument of how the big bad organized religions of the world overan the paganistic perfection of ancient man.

And besides, Heathenism is not a set worldview. In this regard it could be said to be disrespectful by pooling all pagan beliefs from so many unique cultural views into one catch all phrase. Next you thing you know, people will start calling themselves Christian-Wiccans.

Excuse me if I would rather stick to reason rather than distorting ancient cultures, creating new terms or redefining old ones all in the attempt to make me feel more secure.

Final note. If this seems disrespectful please read the previous replies and note the arrogance. Sorry, but I cannot take this aren't we oh so great morally superior open minded backslapping B.S. any more.

edit: an addendum, I realized that I had posted this in a non-debate section. I do not wish to turn this into a debate. Let the rant stand and take it for just that.

Darkdale · #10 12-27-2005, 08:13 PM

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