LDS Gap (priest, Earth, gospel, translation, doctrine)

[Victor]

I have always struggled in understanding the reasoning behind the gap between the Apostacy until Joseph Smith. I was wondering if any of you can give me an example of God working in such a fashion in the Old Testament.

[SoyLeche]

There have been periods of apostacy throughout the ages. Most of the Old Testament is prophets trying to bring people back from apostacy, and most of the New Testament after the Gospels is people trying to keep people from apostacizing. There is no other example of a general apostacy of the same magnitude as the one you are asking about.

As to why the gap - maybe this will help. Specifically, starting where it says "Preparing the Earth for the Restoration" through the end, but reading the whole thing wouldn't hurt. http://speeches.byu.edu/reader/reade...=6083&x=71&y=8

[Victor]

Couple of questions:

If Christians have always had the spirit of dissension and division, how difference would a restoration make if they are bound to screw it up again?

Does Apostacy mean that everything from that moment was wrong? Or only parts of it was wrong?

[SoyLeche]

Originally Posted by Victor

Couple of questions:

If Christians have always had the spirit of dissension and division, how difference would a restoration make if they are bound to screw it up again?

Does Apostacy mean that everything from that moment was wrong? Or only parts of it was wrong?

This is merely my opinion, so take it for what it's worth.

First, I think that there are a couple of things that help the message get less corrupted - starting with the printing press, and followed by the myriad of methods of transmitting copies of information with little chance of variation from one copy to the next that have developed. Instead of Paul writing a letter and having it hand copied dozens of times, Joseph Smith could write a letter, have it type set, proof read it, and turn out a hundred perfect copies. President Hinkley can sit at his computer and type a letter, and it can be sent without error to every local leader in the world in a manner of minutes, if he so desired (baring translation errors, of course, but you get what I mean).

Second, I believe that the Second Coming is pretty close, so I'm not sure we'll have too much of a chance to mess it up too bad.

As per your second question - No, things weren't lost all at once. Apostasy is usually a gradual process, and I would never say that everything that non-LDS Christians believe is false. A lot of truth did make it through. I personally think that the main thing that was lost in the Apostasy was Priesthood Authority. That may fit what you were saying - once it was gone, it was gone till it was restored.

I have a great respect for the Catholic Church for surviving as well as it did, and I also respect the courage and determination of the Reformers. I just want to make that clear.

[Victor]

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

This is merely my opinion, so take it for what it's worth.

I will. Although I was hoping you can get as close to something official if it's not to much to ask.

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

First, I think that there are a couple of things that help the message get less corrupted - starting with the printing press, and followed by the myriad of methods of transmitting copies of information with little chance of variation from one copy to the next that have developed. Instead of Paul writing a letter and having it hand copied dozens of times, Joseph Smith could write a letter, have it type set, proof read it, and turn out a hundred perfect copies. President Hinkley can sit at his computer and type a letter, and it can be sent without error to every local leader in the world in a manner of minutes, if he so desired (baring translation errors, of course, but you get what I mean).

Do you really think this helped things? Afterall, more dissension and denominations sprung from this. People moved away from unity, not toward it. Perhaps you can tell me how exactly this helped unity?

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

Second, I believe that the Second Coming is pretty close, so I'm not sure we'll have too much of a chance to mess it up too bad.

Does this mean that if you did have enough time, it can happen?

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

As per your second question - No, things weren't lost all at once. Apostasy is usually a gradual process, and I would never say that everything that non-LDS Christians believe is false. A lot of truth did make it through. I personally think that the main thing that was lost in the Apostasy was Priesthood Authority. That may fit what you were saying - once it was gone, it was gone till it was restored.

What exactly made them lose it? One error? Two errors? And which error was it exactly?

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

I have a great respect for the Catholic Church for surviving as well as it did, and I also respect the courage and determination of the Reformers. I just want to make that clear.

Messeged received and appreciated. I return the respect.

[SoyLeche]

Originally Posted by Victor

I will. Although I was hoping you can get as close to something official if it's not to much to ask.

Do you really think this helped things? Afterall, more dissension and denominations sprung from this. People moved away from unity, not toward it. Perhaps you can tell me how exactly this helped unity?

Yes, I think it helped, at least for my church. For example, it doesn't really matter which LDS church you go to on a given Sunday, the lessons in Sunday School are going to be very similar (maybe off by a week or two from each other, but pretty close). A church can't get much more unified than that. I also have writings by the current appostles and prophets delivered to my mailbox every month.

Does this mean that if you did have enough time, it can happen?

Of course it could happen. Groups have apostasised. I believe that God has promissed that it won't, but it is within the realm of possibility.

What exactly made them lose it? One error? Two errors? And which error was it exactly?

I don't know. I'm not very well versed in early Christian history. Like I said, though, I believe it has more to do with the Priesthood not being passed on than it does with any altering of doctrine. Why wasnt' it passed on? I really haven't the slightest. DeepShadow and Katz can probably answer that one better.

Messeged received and appreciated. I return the respect.

Thanks

[Victor]

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

Yes, I think it helped, at least for my church. For example, it doesn't really matter which LDS church you go to on a given Sunday, the lessons in Sunday School are going to be very similar (maybe off by a week or two from each other, but pretty close). A church can't get much more unified than that. I also have writings by the current appostles and prophets delivered to my mailbox every month.

I think you may have misunderstood me. I was not specifically talking about LDS community here. You do know that since the invention of the printing press more denominations, philosophies, doctrines, etc. have flourished then before the printing press right? At this point LDS wasn't even around. So I asked what good came of this?

You said more text, better duplicates, etc. would be the result. Which is true but it some to have a negative effect instead of a positive effect. So I ask, what good came from printing more?

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

Of course it could happen. Groups have apostasised. I believe that God has promissed that it won't, but it is within the realm of possibility.

Interesting. I'll be mindful of that.

Originally Posted by SoyLeche

I don't know. I'm not very well versed in early Christian history. Like I said, though, I believe it has more to do with the Priesthood not being passed on than it does with any altering of doctrine. Why wasnt' it passed on? I really haven't the slightest. DeepShadow and Katz can probably answer that one better.

I'll await their response.

[SoyLeche]

Originally Posted by Victor

I think you may have misunderstood me. I was not specifically talking about LDS community here. You do know that since the invention of the printing press more denominations, philosophies, doctrines, etc. have flourished then before the printing press right? At this point LDS wasn't even around. So I asked what good came of this?

You said more text, better duplicates, etc. would be the result. Which is true but it some to have a negative effect instead of a positive effect. So I ask, what good came from printing more?

I think we missed each other then, because I was trying to explain why I believe that the LDS church won't fall into general apostasy.