BAPS and Sri Swaminarayan Sampraday (ritual, rejecting, Earth, incarnation)

[harikrishna]

Jay Swaminarayan

I was ONCE a BAPS follower but not anymore. The scriptuures are damaged. They have been mingled with. They have their own homemade philosophy. Against the teachings of God,

[Don Penguinoini]

Welcome to the forum harikrishna! Do you think you would believe otherwise if you joined teh Original Swaminarayan Sampraday?

[patl101]

Originally Posted by mahesh

Well when it comes to spirituality and the answers of God there is no better common sense attained by man other than abiding in the scriptures of that God whom one has put faith into.

Mahesh is very true, and i feel sorry for penguino as he is very misinformed. leaving aside, all the intellect-mahesh has given(which was excellent), there is a very simple and basic point to portray here. penguino does believe in god, no doubt, but he just hasnt really understood his position and place towards god. He lacks basic sense in the glory ad greatness of god(dont get me wrong, i know that our environmentally influenced human minds are not good enough to know his glory). penguino seriously doesnt know his place in comparision to god. he needs to understand that he is a human, with a human mind. his ideas, theories etc are affected and influenced by his environment, where he grew up etc. for example, in some parts of the world it is OK to do certain things, which are taboo in other parts of the world. e.g if a person grew up believing something bad (e.g murder- probably not the best example) as a daily routine and nothing bad- that would be his idea of something which is OK. therefore a person(not just penguino) needs to know his place. if he doesnt believe in god- then he makes his own theories and does what he ''feels'' is right. if you believe in god- you need to know you are human and everything you feel is right, everyhting your tailored mind wishes to believe is not right if it is against gods. god is great, his words are right- if he tells you that eating meat is a sin(*martin luther king)- it is a sin regardless of what your ''character, love towards him and your good deeds '' are. this goes for everything god says- which is the truth. any person who believes in god and has even the slightest sence knows that he(in this cse penguino) doesnt know better than god. penguino should feel the same. Anything (theories and thoughts) can be made out to look good- even obviously bad things- e.g murder- can in some twisted way be made out to be the right thing to do-seriously. but the reason we know that murder of innocent is bad is becasue this is what we are taught and have a believed perception of. - if we grew up differently this obvious fact may be opposed in belief. In the same way every theory we as humans believe is not correct, becasue thats us- as humans beliveing something. And everyhthing god says is correct and the absolute truth- if you love god(even if you dont love him - but atleast believe in his existance)- this is what you should believe. nothing he says should be questioned or opposed(by using your own intellect). THIS IS WHY WE FOLLOW SCRIPTURES- and not ideas of our polluted and infueced minds. we are dirt and he is great, what he says is true and what we make-up is false, he is right we are wrong-thats it. he is the ONLY CONTROLLER- we are the CONTROLLED.
for some of the other comment by penguino:
Common sense is good- you yourself need to genuinely believe in something according to your sense.- thats why it is good to question things you doubt BUT penguino, your just making up theories and thinking your right. if you not believing in a teaching of god, you should research it (even though gods word it is the ultimate truth)- you should do some research to clear your mind- of any doubts. BUT any common sense will tell you that if you beilieve in GOD- his words from his own mouth are the only truth in this word.
as for pious and good people like martin luther king- yes he was a great man and did graet things- but he wasnt living in accordance with gods word- he wasnt a hindu and therefore didnt belive the badness of eating meat-- he wasnt graced by god to be a follower of this religion, in that life. but penguino, you have a chance- so dont commit sin by thinking u know best.

[Don Penguinoini]

I know you dont mean bad ptl, i appreciate you took the time to try to help me here, i really do. BBut i really BEG you, so much, please dont tell me what is best. You cay whatever you want, i will not change. Im so sorry, but blame god for making me like this.

[patl101]

keep in my that i dont mean to show disrespect when i say this. but what make you think you are right. most of us are FOLLOWERS, we know that were are humans and not right, therefore we FOLLOW what god has told us. we therefore take his WORD as correct and anything oppsed to it as nonsense. from reading your posts- you have many beliefs that are opposed to what god has said. what mahesh is qouting- might seem as he is arguing with you but all he is really doing is stating- what god himself said- and not his oppinion. i just genuinely wanted to know why u are opposed to it- and seem to just beilive what your mind tells you. ---- dont take this the wrong way, im just enquiring.

[harikrishna]

Originally Posted by penguino

Welcome to the forum harikrishna! Do you think you would believe otherwise if you joined teh Original Swaminarayan Sampraday?

I joined the original Sampraday as i saw actual scriptures as they were. I even got to read the handwritten ones once in a yagna recently in Vadtal!! Handwritten by Sadguru Nand saint Shukanand Muni!!!! he is the actual incarnation of Shukdevji Maharaj (son of Vyas Bhagwan) - His writing is so great no even a mistake or spelling mistake within it. It seemed as though it was done by a Sanskrit typing machine or somthing, thats how great his hand writing was. Very fragile too. The brahmin there translated it for me. It was the Desh Vibhaag Lekh .

Since then i have followed only what i should. And not what i think i should. The path of Swaminarayan Bhagwan as it is. As only this will please Him. He states so... There can be no other compromises.

Do you feel that all these scriptures are wrong??? If not then why do you contradict God in not following them?

We are only souls. I as a bhakt would not want anyome to suffer after his/her death. therefore i urge you all followers of swaminarayan Bhagwan to read upon the actual scriptures of Swaminaryan and His saints.

Jai Swaminarayan

[Don Penguinoini]

Originally Posted by patl101

keep in my that i dont mean to show disrespect when i say this. but what make you think you are right. most of us are FOLLOWERS, we know that were are humans and not right, therefore we FOLLOW what god has told us. we therefore take his WORD as correct and anything oppsed to it as nonsense. from reading your posts- you have many beliefs that are opposed to what god has said. what mahesh is qouting- might seem as he is arguing with you but all he is really doing is stating- what god himself said- and not his oppinion. i just genuinely wanted to know why u are opposed to it- and seem to just beilive what your mind tells you. ---- dont take this the wrong way, im just enquiring.

Just so you know, im am at the moment, 13 years old. I havent had much time to ponder over to believe in right and wrong. Its not like i follow what i am told. Honestly, i am hindu before swaminarayan. There is one guru i know of... He said he would never read any religious scriptures, becausee that binds you, it makes you a vertain way and you are shackled down, and hinduism is anything about that. Hinduim is flexibility, and therefore, i am right just as you are.

Dont worry mate, i am not taking this the wrong way.

[Don Penguinoini]

Originally Posted by harikrishna

I joined the original Sampraday as i saw actual scriptures as they were. I even got to read the handwritten ones once in a yagna recently in Vadtal!! Handwritten by Sadguru Nand saint Shukanand Muni!!!! he is the actual incarnation of Shukdevji Maharaj (son of Vyas Bhagwan) - His writing is so great no even a mistake or spelling mistake within it. It seemed as though it was done by a Sanskrit typing machine or somthing, thats how great his hand writing was. Very fragile too. The brahmin there translated it for me. It was the Desh Vibhaag Lekh .

Since then i have followed only what i should. And not what i think i should. The path of Swaminarayan Bhagwan as it is. As only this will please Him. He states so... There can be no other compromises.

Do you feel that all these scriptures are wrong??? If not then why do you contradict God in not following them?

We are only souls. I as a bhakt would not want anyome to suffer after his/her death. therefore i urge you all followers of swaminarayan Bhagwan to read upon the actual scriptures of Swaminaryan and His saints.

Jai Swaminarayan

I dont feel they are wrong. Refer to my previous psot for your answer too

[celina]

People from OSS need to stop ganging up on BAPS. We have our dharm, you have yours. We have the right to call ourselves devotees of Lord Swaminarayan as much as you do. BAPS is pretty much the only swaminarayan sect that hasn't has it's name tarnished, because of bad conduct from so-callled "santos".

[patl101]

celina, if you are a devotee of swaminarayan bhagwan you would know better than to write ill os santos. maharaj said in vachnamrut that sin and repulsion towards towards god and his devotee is an irredeemable sin, and that person can never reach akshardham. therefore you should speak badly of our saints. and about your dharm, i dont think that disobeying gods command with your own reasoning makes dharm valid. it is a made-up dharm and is clearly against bhagwan's command. baps provide reasons for their beliefs, which might even sound believable to some but the basic point is that we follow the command and words of swaminaryan bhagwan, we do what he commanded us to do. baps does not, and finds reasons for its beliefs but they need to understand that we are human, and we can find and reasons and clues and justify our beliefs but we(and no one) are never qualified to use our intellect to go against the commands and order of god- thats what baps forgot and are continuing to force-shut their common sense. so you can call yourseves what you want, make as many temples as you want, but you should always remember that what you are doing is completely against gods command. and to know gods word- you should read the shikshapatri and vachnamrut- not the altere one by baps but the original one- even read the original text from the internet - if you dont trust any other sources. after readin them, then come and say what baps is doing is right.