Was Issac Really Abrahams' Son ?

[RocksTheDock]

I have spent much time analyzing this and today I wonder if Isaac was really Abraham's son. Sarah was much younger than Abraham and so beautiful that both the Egyptian King took her for his wife and then the Abimelech King (A King of the Philistines) took her as his wife. I believe Isaac could actually be the son of the Philistine King, Abimelech.. As I read the passages in Genesis today, I see the special attention Moses gave when re-telling this section of the story to emphasize that the Abimelech King declared he didn't "touch" her, which makes me more convinced he did. Abraham got rich from the livestock and other gifts that the Egyptian King & the Philistine King gave Abraham for their "marriage" to Sarah.. The wealth given by the two Kings to pay retribution for taking Sarah as their wife is convincing when you consider basic human nature. She did not get pregnant by the Egyptian King but I wonder if she did by the Abimelech King. If she did produce Issac based on her short marriage to the King of the Philistines, this would give the Jews just as much right as anyone through linage in title to Philistines lands.

[TashaN]

So the Jews have nothing to do with Abraham?

[Heneni]

Originally Posted by RocksTheDock

As I read the passages in Genesis today, I see the special attention Moses gave when re-telling this section of the story to emphasize that the Abimelech King declared he didn't "touch" her, which makes me more convinced he did.

Sound like Moses prostituted sarah out to every king he could find to make a quick buck here and there. Im not convinced that is what happened.

I am however convinced that Sarah concieved isaac in the same way mary concieved jesus. Im not saying that sarah was a virgin, im saying that both sarah and mary concieved supernaturally.

They were both visited by angels before they became pregnant.

[3.14]

Originally Posted by Heneni

They were both visited by angels before they became pregnant.

sounds like some of the documenteries about sexual intercourse i have been watching

[RocksTheDock]

Originally Posted by Heneni

Sound like Moses prostituted sarah out to every king he could find to make a quick buck here and there. Im not convinced that is what happened.

I am however convinced that Sarah concieved isaac in the same way mary concieved jesus. Im not saying that sarah was a virgin, im saying that both sarah and mary concieved supernaturally.

They were both visited by angels before they became pregnant.

Hey, I love your faith. The story of Abraham and Sarah never seemed to really add up and the special emphasis Moses used in re-telling the story always gave me a feeling that he wondered about this as well .. but like you, he had tremendous faith in his belief that God intervenes in matters of pregnancy and in all other aspects of his life.

[RocksTheDock]

I read the following tonight:

Clearly, the development of the Israelites in Canaan is far more complex than the picture given in the Bible. Research into settlement patterns suggests that the ethnogenesis of Israel as a people was a complex process involving mainly native pastoralist groups in Canaan (perhaps including Habiru and Shasu), with some infiltration from outside groups such as Hittites and Armeans from the north, as well as southern Shasu groups such as the Kenites- some of whom may have come from areas controlled by Egypt. Genetically, Palestinian Jews show closest connections with Kurdish people and other groups from Northern Iraq, suggesting that this is the area from which most of their ancestors originally came - a fact confirmed archaeologically from the Khirbet Kerak period down to the end of the Middle Bronze Age period, with the spread of the Hurrians (Biblical Horites), and in the Early Iron Age I period with the spread of Shasu (=Egyptian) and Ahlamu (=Assyrian Akkadian, i.e.wandering Aramaeans.

Issac went back to Harran in northern Iraq to find a wife, so this would make sense. Assuming his mother (Sarah) an Iraq and his father a Philistine King. His son, Jacob (Israel) also traveled to Harran to find his wife..

[mohammed_beiruti]

so beautiful that both the Egyptian King took her for his wife and then the Abimelech King (A King of the Philistines) took her as his wife

I don't belive in that mentioned story [in quotion], the story is a lie itself ,niether do millions of muslims.

[11:71] And his wife was standing (there), and she laughed: but We gave her glad tidings of Ishaq, and after him, of Ya'qub.

[11:72] She said: "Alas for me! shall I bear a child, seeing I am an old woman, and my husband here is an old man? That would indeed be a wonderful thing!"

[11:73] They said: "Dost thou wonder at Allah's decree? The grace of Allah and His blessings on you, O ye people of the house! for He is indeed worthy of all praise, full of all glory!"

[Heneni]

Originally Posted by RocksTheDock

I read the following tonight:

Clearly, the development of the Israelites in Canaan is far more complex than the picture given in the Bible. Research into settlement patterns suggests that the ethnogenesis of Israel as a people was a complex process involving mainly native pastoralist groups in Canaan (perhaps including Habiru and Shasu), with some infiltration from outside groups such as Hittites and Armeans from the north, as well as southern Shasu groups such as the Kenites- some of whom may have come from areas controlled by Egypt. Genetically, Palestinian Jews show closest connections with Kurdish people and other groups from Northern Iraq, suggesting that this is the area from which most of their ancestors originally came - a fact confirmed archaeologically from the Khirbet Kerak period down to the end of the Middle Bronze Age period, with the spread of the Hurrians (Biblical Horites), and in the Early Iron Age I period with the spread of Shasu (=Egyptian) and Ahlamu (=Assyrian Akkadian, i.e.wandering Aramaeans.

Issac went back to Harran in northern Iraq to find a wife, so this would make sense. Assuming his mother (Sarah) an Iraq and his father a Philistine King. His son, Jacob (Israel) also traveled to Harran to find his wife..

Hi rockthedocks

Are we assuming that sarah was still within her childbearing years when she was given as a wife to the philistine king? How can we know for sure?

[sandy whitelinger]

Originally Posted by RocksTheDock

I have spent much time analyzing this and today I wonder if Isaac was really Abraham's son. Sarah was much younger than Abraham and so beautiful that both the Egyptian King took her for his wife and then the Abimelech King (A King of the Philistines) took her as his wife. I believe Isaac could actually be the son of the Philistine King, Abimelech.. As I read the passages in Genesis today, I see the special attention Moses gave when re-telling this section of the story to emphasize that the Abimelech King declared he didn't "touch" her, which makes me more convinced he did. Abraham got rich from the livestock and other gifts that the Egyptian King & the Philistine King gave Abraham for their "marriage" to Sarah.. The wealth given by the two Kings to pay retribution for taking Sarah as their wife is convincing when you consider basic human nature. She did not get pregnant by the Egyptian King but I wonder if she did by the Abimelech King. If she did produce Issac based on her short marriage to the King of the Philistines, this would give the Jews just as much right as anyone through linage in title to Philistines lands.

Having a fertile imagination does not change Scriptural facts. Issac was the son Abraham.

[RocksTheDock]

Originally Posted by Heneni

Hi rockthedocks

Are we assuming that sarah was still within her childbearing years when she was given as a wife to the philistine king? How can we know for sure?

We can't. The first five books of the old testament were used by Moses to build a sense of a people and a culture that had been crushed and lost over 450 years. Taking that many into the unknown then keeping them together as a people while wandering the desert for 40 years required extreme faith by his follower, in he and his brother. Using a book of stories and laws helped accomplished order and maintain control under what I can only imagine were very difficult circumstances. Moses was a privileged member of Egyptian society and was exposed to the inner workings and concepts of leadership. He knew how important laws were and how important it was to write those laws down to legitimize them. He probably wrote these stories from memory, or with the help of elders; and certainly from divine inspiration. I just suggest that the story of Abraham was recounted hundreds of years after it happened and although many of the facts are probably correct, I am sure he told the story to serve his cause. Only later were these five chapters turned from a book of laws used to inspire and colonize a people, into a larger body of work deemed the absolute will and word of God.