Heavenly Mother in Bible

[Halcyon]

Originally Posted by ayani

i really don't read those verses in the same way, idea. to compare anthropomorphizing wisdom to worship of a second divinity alongside God is far-fetched, imo.

Jews are strict monotheists- One God, HaShem. yes, there are aspects of HaShem that are feminized in kabbalic literature, but that does not mean that there is another being apart from God. why would there have to be? if God is beyond gender (yes, we call God Father, but most Christians believe that God is not a man like one's uncle or milk man) and almighty in scope and vision, why can't God image and form humans into both male and female beings?

I have to agree with idea on this Gracie, Jews now are strict monotheists, but the OT is littered with references to the people of Israel worshipping other gods.
I think you have to understand the stories in the context of the timeframe in which they were set.
We have the Israelites carving a monotheism out of the native polytheism of Canaan, we see them integrating the war god Yahweh with the head of the Canaanite pantheon, El.
Their culture then cycles though phases of monotheism devoted to this new G-d then back to devotion of many gods, including Yahweh's consort Asherah. Monotheism is only reinstated via the power of strict monotheistic kings, evetually culminating in a declaration that monotheism is the only religion of the Jews either in the first century BC or AD, I can't recall, not long before Christianity sprouted up anyway.

[Starfish]

Originally Posted by idea

If you don’t mind, I would like all who currently worship the female Goddess to please join this thread and teach us how.

I am frustrated that the LDS church does not do anything more than just acknowledge Her existence. As a female, I need a female role model, I need female guidance. Is that so horrible to suggest? Why should I feel uncomfortable in speaking about Heavenly Mother at church? Why should it be a taboo subject? Why cannot we sing praises to Her as we do for Jesus, and for God?

I love my Father, but I really need a Mother too. Anyone who is able to more fully bring me to Her would be greatly appreciated.

The thought that the Holy Spirit is our Heavenly Mother is the only thing that makes sense to me… The comforter – the nurturer – the small soft voice - these are feminine traits. If the Holy spirit is not Heavenly Mother, I think I might start getting very upset that She would be completely shut out of our lives. What kind of a horrible being would take children away from their Mother? What kind of a Goddess would even need the protection of another being? It is frustrating and confusing.

I've never felt the subject was taboo. We simply don't have much doctrine about her, and IMO it's important to not stray into speculation, because that speculation often becomes confused with doctrine. I love the idea of a Heavenly mother. But have you seen the abuse the concept of two heavenly parents gets online? It's really too bad that such a lovely thing as the concept of a mother in heaven would get trampled in the dirt, but it does.

(I'm having long pauses here as I type, because I'm trying to understand your feelings.) I lost my mother as a child and know that yearning for a mother-figure. Fortuantely, I had a wonderful father who raised me and all the other adults in my life were loving and nurturing, so I was okay. But when I die, she'll be the first one I'll seek out. I love the thought of our reunion some day. This helps me understand and anticipate a similar reunion with my Heavenly Mother as well.

I feel that she is very aware of us as our Father is. I don't doubt her love and concern. Just as I don't doubt the love and concern my earthly mother still has for me.

[idea]

Originally Posted by silvermoon383

This might be the paper you're thinking of Idea, and if not, then it's another good one you can read.

http://www.fairlds.org/pubs/MotherInHeaven.pdf

Yes, I am familiar with that one - thank you.

Some other things I noticed during my scripture reading this morning...:

Rachel (Jacob’s chosen wife he works an extra ten years for) is only able to conceived after ….

Genesis 30:14-15 There is a squabble over some mandrakes.
14 And Reuben went in the days of wheat harvest, and found mandrakes in the field, and brought them unto his mother Leah. Then Rachel said to Leah, Give me, I pray thee, of thy son's mandrakes.
15 And she said unto her, Is it a small matter that thou hast ataken my husband? and wouldest thou take away my son's mandrakes also? And Rachel said, Therefore he shall lie with thee to night for thy son's mandrakes.

Shortly thereafter Rachel conceives her first child:

Gen 30:22
22 And God remembered Rachel, and God hearkened to her, and opened her womb.

So, what are mandrakes? You have to read the wiki article: Mandrake

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And it does not stop with the women – Jacob uses the powers of Asherah as well, recall he gets to keep the speckled cattle...
Gen 30:39

So let’s ask our self – what “rods” exactly is Jacob using here?
Green poplar hazel chestnut tree rods

I cam across this:
http://www.witchesofwicca.com/herbs.html
poplar - money
hazel - fertility
chestnut – money, healing
through these rods, Jacob attains much wealth.

Asherah is commonly worshiped with a rod - link
from wiki link Asherah Pole

in some cases it seems to be allowed - people commanded to look to the pole to save them from the snakes etc... or how about the rod that was used to divide the red sea?

8 And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live.

41 And he did straiten them in the wilderness with his rod; for they hardened their hearts, even as ye have; and the Lord straitened them because of their iniquity. He sent fiery flying serpents among them; and after they were bitten he prepared a way that they might be chealed; and the labor which they had to perform was to look; and because of the simpleness of the way, or the easiness of it, there were many who perished.


in other places, it is forbidden. When is it OK and when not?

so... where do you cross the line between Christianity and the wiccan arts? If many in the OT did it - and were blessed for doing it.... comments?

Thank you all for your comments, I will be back and thinking about them....

[madhatter85]

Idea, do you not realize that "God" is Both Husband and Wife?

when you pray to God you are in effect talking to your spiritual parents, The womanly advice does coem from your heavenly Mother.

Why do you think it is impossible for any single person to be exalted by themselves? why do you think marriage is an eternal principle?

God would not be God without his wife. just as well, cannot inherit the same glory without being eternally sealed to our spouse. Only in that, do we become heirs to the same glory as our father in heaven.

[Riverwolf]

How do you know that YHWH isn't a female Goddess? Don't forget that the Bible was written by a patriarchal society, so masculine words were put to the divine. Father, Him, He, etc. But don't forget that words are just words; the idea is the most important thing. If you want a female role model, then just pray to YHWH and Yeshua as if they were women. Instead of "Our father, who art in heaven..." say "Our mother, who art in heaven..." (Assuming the LDS church uses that prayer; does it?)

[idea]

Originally Posted by madhatter85

Idea, do you not realize that "God" is Both Husband and Wife?
when you pray to God you are in effect talking to your spiritual parents, The womanly advice does coem from your heavenly Mother.

You sound like you are talking trinity again – Heavenly Mother and Heavenly Father are two separate distinct people, Just like Jesus is separate too. Just like we do not pray to Jesus, we also do not pray to Heavenly Mother. “Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name” that is who we pray to. I have no problem with Heavenly Father being the head of the household, you need order / respect. I love Heavenly Father too, need His strength and support as much as I need Her compassion and feminine help. Yes, whenever I pray, I feel that everyone is in the conversation, even though I only address Heavenly Father.

I am only frustrated about the amount of information available about Her. Now that I think about it though, there is about as much info about Her as there is about Heavenly Father. In most of the OT and NT – it is all about Jesus, not about God or Heavenly Mother. I used to think that the God of the OT was Heavenly Father – now I know most of it was Jesus.

I alsways thought it was God talking to Abraham and Moses - it was not God, it was Jesus...

From Guide to the scriptures:
Premortal existence of Christ: The Lord appeared unto Abram, Gen. 12:7 (Gen. 17:1; 18:1; Abr. 2:6–8). The Lord spoke unto Moses face to face, Ex. 33:11 (Deut. 34:10; Moses 1:1–2). I saw the Lord standing upon the altar, Amos 9:1. In the beginning, the Word was with God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, John 1:1, 14 (1 Jn. 1:1–3). Before Abraham was, I am, John 8:58. Glorify thou me with the glory which I had with thee before the world was, John 17:5. Isaiah verily saw my Redeemer as I and my brother Jacob have seen him, 2 Ne. 11:2–3. On the morrow come I into the world, 3 Ne. 1:12–14. Christ was before the world began, 3 Ne. 26:5 (John 6:62). As I appear unto thee will I appear unto my people in the flesh, Ether 3:14–17. Enoch saw the Lord and walked with him, D&C 107:48–49. My Beloved Son, which was my Beloved and Chosen from the beginning, Moses 4:2. The Lord said: Whom shall I send? And one answered like unto the Son of Man: Here am I, send me, Abr. 3:27.

John 13:7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also…

I know that are pretty much the same in all aspects except being physically different. We know God by knowing Jesus… Jesus is male too though… There are not really any differences between Jesus and God, but I can’t help but think there may be differences between male / female. We can come to know God through Jesus, but can we come to know our Heavenly Mother through him? Only in part.

Originally Posted by Riverwolf

How do you know that YHWH isn't a female Goddess?

He is a Father. It takes both a Mother and a Father to create children. They both exist, not one or the other, both.

Don't forget that the Bible was written by a patriarchal society, so masculine words were put to the divine. Father, Him, He, etc. But don't forget that words are just words; the idea is the most important thing. If you want a female role model, then just pray to YHWH and Yeshua as if they were women. Instead of "Our father, who art in heaven..." say "Our mother, who art in heaven..." (Assuming the LDS church uses that prayer; does it?)

We pray to our Father in Heaven, no one else.

[madhatter85]

Originally Posted by idea

You sound like you are talking trinity again – Heavenly Mother and Heavenly Father are two separate distinct people, Just like Jesus is separate too. Just like we do not pray to Jesus, we also do not pray to Heavenly Mother. “Our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name” that is who we pray to. I have no problem with Heavenly Father being the head of the household, you need order / respect. I love Heavenly Father too, need His strength and support as much as I need Her compassion and feminine help. Yes, whenever I pray, I feel that everyone is in the conversation, even though I only address Heavenly Father.

I am only frustrated about the amount of information available about Her. Now that I think about it though, there is about as much info about Her as there is about Heavenly Father. In most of the OT and NT – it is all about Jesus, not about God or Heavenly Mother. I used to think that the God of the OT was Heavenly Father – now I know most of it was Jesus.

I alsways thought it was God talking to Abraham and Moses - it was not God, it was Jesus...

From Guide to the scriptures:
Premortal existence of Christ: The Lord appeared unto Abram, Gen. 12:7 (Gen. 17:1; 18:1; Abr. 2:6–8). The Lord spoke unto Moses face to face, Ex. 33:11 (Deut. 34:10; Moses 1:1–2). I saw the Lord standing upon the altar, Amos 9:1. In the beginning, the Word was with God. And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, John 1:1, 14 (1 Jn. 1:1–3). Before Abraham was, I am, John 8:58. Glorify thou me with the glory which I had with thee before the world was, John 17:5. Isaiah verily saw my Redeemer as I and my brother Jacob have seen him, 2 Ne. 11:2–3. On the morrow come I into the world, 3 Ne. 1:12–14. Christ was before the world began, 3 Ne. 26:5 (John 6:62). As I appear unto thee will I appear unto my people in the flesh, Ether 3:14–17. Enoch saw the Lord and walked with him, D&C 107:48–49. My Beloved Son, which was my Beloved and Chosen from the beginning, Moses 4:2. The Lord said: Whom shall I send? And one answered like unto the Son of Man: Here am I, send me, Abr. 3:27.

John 13:7 If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also…

I know that are pretty much the same in all aspects except being physically different. We know God by knowing Jesus… Jesus is male too though… There are not really any differences between Jesus and God, but I can’t help but think there may be differences between male / female. We can come to know God through Jesus, but can we come to know our Heavenly Mother through him? Only in part.



He is a Father. It takes both a Mother and a Father to create children. They both exist, not one or the other, both.



We pray to our Father in Heaven, no one else.

exactly, but the motherly advice does come from your heavenly mother.... Man and Woman = God, not one or the other alone

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by madhatter85

Idea, do you not realize that "God" is Both Husband and Wife?

What? Where on earth did you come up with that little tidbit? Have you ever heard a General Authority say that? Can you find it in any of the scriptures? The answer to both of these questions is an unqualified "NO"!

when you pray to God you are in effect talking to your spiritual parents, The womanly advice does coem from your heavenly Mother.

So why didn't Jesus instruct us to pray to "Our Mother and Father in Heaven"? He specifically said we should pray after this manner: "Our Father who art in Heaven..."

Why do you think it is impossible for any single person to be exalted by themselves? why do you think marriage is an eternal principle?

God would not be God without his wife. just as well, cannot inherit the same glory without being eternally sealed to our spouse. Only in that, do we become heirs to the same glory as our father in heaven.

That's doctrinal. The first part of your post isn't. You need to learn the difference between stating doctrine and speculating on doctrine. If you stood up in Church and said what you did in a Sacrament Meeting talk, you'd find yourself in the Bishop's office right after the meeting, and it would be a long, long time before you were ever asked to speak in Church again.