Which of these 3 divine calamities are Historical in your view? (tradition, scriptures)

[PureX]

The flood actually did happen, though it did not cover the entire world, of course. It was a great disaster for the people of it's specific time and place.

[YmirGF]

Originally Posted by PureX

The flood actually did happen, though it did not cover the entire world, of course. It was a great disaster for the people of it's specific time and place.

Yes, and floods occur every year along the Mississipi. Curiously, I don't hear the locals saying the flood waters covered the "whole world". The real question is if the floods in the geological record are actually during the time of the alleged person called Noah. This "evidence" is merely circumstancial.

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by gnostic

The only problem with the Black Sea flood is that it happened at least 2-and-half thousand years before that of Noah's supposed Flood.

How do you reckon a date for Noah's flood? How does it happening before your Noah date to negate the concept that the Biblical flood is based on the flooding of the Black Sea?

Regards,
Scott

[PureX]

Originally Posted by YmirGF

Yes, and floods occur every year along the Mississipi. Curiously, I don't hear the locals saying the flood waters covered the "whole world". The real question is if the floods in the geological record are actually during the time of the alleged person called Noah. This "evidence" is merely circumstancial.

There was no person called Noah. The biblical flood story is a myth that was created by a real event. Most myths begin in real event.

[gnostic]

Originally Posted by PureX

How do you reckon a date for Noah's flood? How does it happening before your Noah date to negate the concept that the Biblical flood is based on the flooding of the Black Sea?

My dating system is using the Jewish Calendar. On the Jewish Calendar, the year 2008 is 5768 in the Jewish Calendar. Ask a Jew about their Jewish Era (JE), and they will tell it to you.

To calculate the creation, I just simply do the math,

5768-2000 = 3768 BC

I would use this 3768 as the basis of doing all my calculation of the Genesis, to get our era of BC.

Then I did the math, using the generations of Genesis 5, I have worked out that Noah was born 1056 years after Adam's creation (1056 JE), which would make it

3768-1056 = 2704 BC

Noah was 500 when he had the vision or instruction from God to build the Ark, which would be 2204 BC (or 1556 years after Adam's creation or JE). The flood happened hundred year later, and according to Jewish tradition, just 1 week AFTER Methuselah's death. So Noah was 600-year-old, which according to Jewish Calendar, is 1656 JE.

3768-1656 = 2104 BC

Using the Jewish Calendar, may be not the right estimate, but others have put the date to 2358 BC.

When did the great Black Sea flood occurs?

According to the theory or best estimate, around 5600 BC. That's a difference of 3596 years.

That's hell a lot of difference in time, even if you use the other calculation of 2348 BC (which is 3252 years difference) instead of mine.

The time of Black Sea Flood occur at a different time, and was a regional flood not a global one. Taking these factors in mind that the Black Sea Flood would not have mattered much in Noah's time, because almost 3600 years have passed.

Also you have to considered that in 2104 BC, there were no great flood occurring in this period. In the Mesopotamia, the 3rd Dynasty of Ur remained unbroken. If a great flood had occur, this dynasty would have died out.

Also, the Eridu Genesis, a extant but fragmented clay tablets about the Sumerian myth of the Deluge, with Ziusudra as the hero, was found to be dated in 23rd century BC, so this older Flood story, predated that only Noah's Flood (according to my calculation) but also predated the composition of the Genesis by a thousand year (or more, depending on the dating of Genesis).

[Troublemane]

I clicked on the "Flood" myth before I saw you specifically were talking about the flood myth, with noah and the ark and all. That story may have some validity, in terms of a huge flood---after the ice age, the ocean levels did rise significantly, there are submerged caves with prehistoric art on their walls---but not a literal Noah, no.

[PureX]

Originally Posted by gnostic

lso, the Eridu Genesis, a extant but fragmented clay tablets about the Sumerian myth of the Deluge, with Ziusudra as the hero, was found to be dated in 23rd century BC, so this older Flood story, predated that only Noah's Flood (according to my calculation) but also predated the composition of the Genesis by a thousand year (or more, depending on the dating of Genesis).

But the story doesn't have to originate with it's writing. It may have been handed down orally for almost any length of time before being recorded in written text.

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by PureX

But the story doesn't have to originate with it's writing. It may have been handed down orally for almost any length of time before being recorded in written text.

Not to mention that human paleontology figures man's history to be ever so much longer than the "begats" of the Torah. Neolithic Lower Egypt was firmly established about 5500 BC, the First Dynasty founded about 3150 united upper and lower Egypt. This means the flood of the Black Sea was only a century old around the time that Egypt became recognizable as a culture.

Regards,
Scott