Do You Know Why You Don't Believe? (beliefs, experience, atheist)

[Wandered Off]

Originally Posted by Super Universe

God doesn't prove Himself to you because that would violate your free will.

This is a non-sequitur. A lack of information never enhances free will, and proof does not compromise the freedom of will. If anything, it enhances free will by allowing us to use our free will to make informed choices with better knowledge of possible consequences.

Would "proof" eliminate free will?

[mball1297]

Originally Posted by Super Universe

How exactly could the universe prove the non-existence of God? If you could actually answer this you would have a Nobel Prize awaiting...

The same way you think it proves God's existence.

You don't have to trust a building, you can refuse to enter it. You've never had one collapse on you? I think some people in China might have thought the same thing. You trust the sun will come up everyday in the future because it has everyday before? The past does not make the future. You are a very trusting sort, too trusting.

I could refuse to enter the building, and I would if there were some evidence that something was wrong with it. Otherwise, I'm living my life in fear constantly, and that's not a good way to go through life. Those peopl in China would disagree, but hat's their experience, I thought we were talking about me here. You're right that the past does not make the future, but I have to have something to base my beliefs on, or else I'm just going through life not trusting anything including my own existence. I'm apparenlty less trusting than you.

God's existence has exactly ZERO implications on your life because you already have a life. It's a gift, free from God. You already have a universe, earth, and body built to host you and you can do whatever you want with it. God doesn't prove Himself to you because that would violate your free will.

Then, why do I care whether God exists? I only care about things which have some implication in my life.

I see no good reason to believe in the existence of the Eiffel Tower. None. And there is nothing you can do to change my mind.

Good for you. It's a little ridiculous, but you're welcome to that belief.

[mball1297]

Originally Posted by Super Universe

Ah, so what's in it for you, huh? What do you get out of it other than a beautiful earth and a body, a life? That's not enough for you though, you wanted to be rich and famous as well.

Sigh...

No, not what's in it for me. Where does the idea of calling a bird "God" get me? I could call my inagination "God", but I'm no better off than if I say there is no God. I still have an imagination.

[Super Universe]

Originally Posted by Wandered Off

This is a non-sequitur. A lack of information never enhances free will, and proof does not compromise the freedom of will. If anything, it enhances free will by allowing us to use our free will to make informed choices with better knowledge of possible consequences.

Would "proof" eliminate free will?

A lack of information never enhances free will? Hmm... Then a one year old child's free will is limited by it's knowledge. This is correct, to some degree, but moreso in the child's ability to imagine and less so in it's ability to explore. A one year old child will walk straight off a cliff, that's about as "free will" as it gets.

Proof of God would violate your reason to exist. You don't have to find God today or tomorrow. He is not in a hurry. You will find God when you prove to yourself that He exists.

[Super Universe]

Originally Posted by mball1297

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The same way you think it proves God's existence.



I could refuse to enter the building, and I would if there were some evidence that something was wrong with it. Otherwise, I'm living my life in fear constantly, and that's not a good way to go through life. Those peopl in China would disagree, but hat's their experience, I thought we were talking about me here. You're right that the past does not make the future, but I have to have something to base my beliefs on, or else I'm just going through life not trusting anything including my own existence. I'm apparenlty less trusting than you.



Then, why do I care whether God exists? I only care about things which have some implication in my life.

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Good for you. It's a little ridiculous, but you're welcome to that belief.

Exactly! What's the difference between us then? What controls your view of humanity, the earth, and the universe?

You have to have something to base your belief's on? And what do you base your belief of the universe, time, and life on? Even the scientists themselves will tell you that they don't have either figured out.

You don't care whether God exists. You don't care because, to you, God hasn't done a thing for you. Doesn't He know you wanted to be rich? How did He mess that up?

[Wandered Off]

Originally Posted by Super Universe

Proof of God would violate your reason to exist. You don't have to find God today or tomorrow. He is not in a hurry. You will find God when you prove to yourself that He exists.

If, as you say, that was your reason to exist, then what happens once you "prove to yourself" God's existence? You no longer have a reason to exist, right? Do you cease? Did your free will vanish?

[Super Universe]

Originally Posted by mball1297

No, not what's in it for me. Where does the idea of calling a bird "God" get me? I could call my inagination "God", but I'm no better off than if I say there is no God. I still have an imagination.

Once again you think the universe, the earth, and life is supposed to be about what you think is best for you.

Think of a young child crying after getting their shots. Do you think the child knows what's "best"?

[Super Universe]

Originally Posted by Wandered Off

If, as you say, that was your reason to exist, then what happens once you "prove to yourself" God's existence? You no longer have a reason to exist, right? Do you cease? Did your free will vanish?

Then you are accepted into heaven. Heaven is not a place the ignorant go to ask all the questions they've ever wanted to know. You don't get to go there until you have already found those answers.