Euthanasia (moral, Creator, church, zealous, experience)

w00t · #1 10-20-2007, 02:28 PM

I believe we have the right to end our own lives if they are intolerable due to terminal illness including Altzheimers. I think, with certain safeguards, we should be able to ask someone to help us die if we can't do it for ourselves.I feel quite passionately about this subject after our experience this year when my husband, was desperately ill after a brain haemorrhage. I knew his wishes would have been to let him die rather than let him remain in a profoundly disabled state. I made sure the doctors knew this too. Although he has made a remarkable recovery, he does have a significant level of disability and sometimes he wonders if he would be better off dead! Should he have another haemorrhage he insists that no treatment is given, it will be down to me to make sure his wishes are fulfilled, by whatever means available to me!

ChristineES · #2 10-20-2007, 02:40 PM

This is one tough issue. As far as I can tell, no where in the Bible does it say that it is wrong to end your own life if you are going to suffer (I am sure someone may come up with a verse that will tell me otherwise). If someone is only alive because a machine is keeping him or her that way, is he really alive? My mother says she does not want to be hooked up to machines that keep her alive. If that happens, I would, morally, have to respect her wishes.

About killing someone who is suffering and can't do it themselves, I can't be sure. I have a hard time harming any living creature. I feel guilty washing spiders down my shower drain! I am not sure if I could kill anyone.

w00t · #3 10-20-2007, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChristineES

This is one tough issue. As far as I can tell, no where in the Bible does it say that it is wrong to end your own life if you are going to suffer (I am sure someone may come up with a verse that will tell me otherwise). If someone is only alive because a machine is keeping him or her that way, is he really alive? My mother says she does not want to be hooked up to machines that keep her alive. If that happens, I would, morally, have to respect her wishes.

About killing someone who is suffering and can't do it themselves, I can't be sure. I have a hard time harming any living creature. I feel guilty washing spiders down my shower drain! I am not sure if I could kill anyone.

I hope I am never faced with that scenario, but hope I have the courage to go through with it if need be, and face the consequences!

nutshell · #4 10-20-2007, 04:29 PM

For me the issue comes up when it's doctors asked to do the mercy killing. I believe it should be a doctor because of the medical training. However, maybe this needs to be a specialty that takes extra education and certain set standards.

Scott1 · #5 10-20-2007, 04:39 PM

Intentional euthanasia, whatever its forms or motives, is murder. It is gravely contrary to the dignity of the human person and to the respect due to the living God, his Creator.

Discontinuing medical procedures that are burdensome, dangerous, extraordinary, or disproportionate to the expected outcome can be legitimate; it is the refusal of "over-zealous" treatment. Here one does not will to cause death; one's inability to impede it is merely accepted. The decisions should be made by the patient if he is competent and able or, if not, by those legally entitled to act for the patient, whose reasonable will and legitimate interests must always be respected.

Even if death is thought imminent, the ordinary care owed to a sick person cannot be legitimately interrupted. The use of painkillers to alleviate the sufferings of the dying, even at the risk of shortening their days, can be morally in conformity with human dignity if death is not willed as either an end or a means, but only foreseen and tolerated as inevitable Palliative care is a special form of disinterested charity. As such it should be encouraged. (CCC)

Halcyon · #6 10-20-2007, 05:47 PM

If someone were in great suffering, had no chance of making significant improvements and personally asked me to end their suffering, I believe the morally correct thing to do would be to conform to their wishes.
However, I wouldn't do so straight away. I would want to make sure that the will to die did not arise from some temporary mental condition i.e. depression, and had they been mentally fit would not have asked.

As such I also disagree with the Catholic Church's position as quoted by Scott above. I don't see a person living in terrible suffering and wanting it to end day after day as dignified.

Scott1 · #7 10-20-2007, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halcyon

As such I also disagree with the Catholic Church's position as quoted by Scott above. I don't see a person living in terrible suffering and wanting it to end day after day as dignified.

I guess you didn't acutally read the entire text.....

Halcyon · #8 10-20-2007, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott1

I guess you didn't acutally read the entire text.....

I read it all.

If someone's death was imminent, then there wouldn't really be an issue would there? So, i'd agree with the CCC where it speaks of keeping them as comfortable as possible until the end through pain killers etc.

I disagree in particular with this sentence;

Quote:

Intentional euthanasia, whatever its forms or motives, is murder. It is gravely contrary to the dignity of the human person and to the respect due to the living God, his Creator.

If someone has five years of pain and suffering left and wants it to end, I do not see what dignity it does them to keep them in their suffering state against their wishes.
But this is a difference of opinion more on doctrinal grounds than moral ones I feel, I'm not suggesting Catholics actually prefer people to suffer than die, and understand that you feel bound by God's law not to kill anyone for any reason.

Scott1 · #9 10-20-2007, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Halcyon

I read it all.

K... my bad.

Quote:

If someone's death was imminent, then there wouldn't really be an issue would there?

Huh? Suffering for 10 minutes is horrible... suffering for 10 years is horrible... what makes you think death being "imminent" has anything to do with it?

Besides... I don't think there is a Doctor in the world that can estimate for sure the time someone is going to die with the exception of air/blood/circulation issues.

Quote:

If someone has five years of pain and suffering left and wants it to end, I do not see what dignity it does them to keep them in their suffering state against their wishes.

Who is to decide what is "enough" suffering? The patient? At what age do you let them decide? 5 years old?.... 13?.....18? Who decides if they are competant to make that decision... medical professionals? Insurance companies?

What constitutes suffering? Is mental retardation... autism... MS.... suffering enough to kill a human being?

Why does it have to be physical suffering... what about mental suffering? Why shouldn't all depressed people be able to go down to the hospital and TELL the Doctor to enforce their legal right to end their life?

What about those born with genetic defects.... there is a medical certaintly that these people will eventually suffer and die.... should parents being able to kill them to prevent future suffering?

Should I go on.... or do you get my point?

Quote:

and understand that you feel bound by God's law not to kill anyone for any reason.

No... there are reasons to kill people... I just find it hard to believe that with modern medicine being what it is that people actually believe we can't keep people from PHYSICAL suffering during the end of their life. I can give you enough pain killers that I could saw you in half with a chainsaw and you'll smile the whole time.... this is not about physical suffering... this issue is about viewing people who are near the end of their life with pity.... it's more about the guilt of family members who want it to end (in my opinion)..... but I could be wrong.