The role of guilt vs. the role of regret (moral, mystic)

[MysticSang'ha]

Main Entry: guilt
Pronunciation: 'gilt
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, delinquency, guilt, from Old English gylt delinquency
1 : the fact of having committed a breach of conduct especially violating law and involving a penalty; broadly : guilty conduct
2 a : the state of one who has committed an offense especially consciously b : feelings of culpability especially for imagined offenses or from a sense of inadequacy : SELF-REPROACH
3 : a feeling of culpability for offenses





Main Entry: 1re·gret
Pronunciation: ri-'gret
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): re·gret·ted; re·gret·ting
Etymology: Middle English regretten, from Anglo-French regreter, from re- + -greter (perhaps of Germanic origin; akin to Old Norse grAta to weep) -- more at GREET
transitive verb
1 a : to mourn the loss or death of b : to miss very much
2 : to be very sorry for <regrets his mistakes>
intransitive verb : to experience regret
- re·gret·ter noun




Both definitions taken from the Merriam-Webster online dictionary:

http://www.m-w.com/





What is the difference, if there is one to you? Are both states valuable roles in moral and ethical codes in religion? Is one more valuable than the other?




We had an amazing lecture today at our dharma center on this exact topic, and I wanted to get a taste of other religious viewpoints. FWIW, our lecture taught that there is a fine line between guilt and regret on the basis that one state of mind suggests a sense of permanence and the other suggests a sense of impermanence.



One suggests a fixed state of being, while the other suggests a momentary lapse of judgement.



Even though both states of mind implies a sense of responsibility on the part of the person doing wrong, there seems to be a difference on the part of how long one should stay in the remorseful state.



Thoughts? Which state of mind is the better wake-up call for moral action?




Peace,
Mystic

[Sunstone]

My hunch is that it's more practical to feel regret than it is to feel guilt because it would seem to me that one is more likely to learn their lesson and change their behavior if they feel regret than if they feel guilt. After all, guilt implies a permanent state, so why make an effort to change? While regret implies a lapse of judgement, so there is every reason to work hard to make better judgements in the future. Just my hunch.

I also think it's possible that just as lust is excessive sexual desire, and just as greed is excessive desire for wealth, guilt might repressent and excessive clinging to regret. A clinging that focuses us not on what we can do to change our behavior, but rather focuses us on our feelings. That is, guilt might be very self-indulgent. Just another guess.

[MysticSang'ha]

Originally Posted by Sunstone

My hunch is that it's more practical to feel regret than it is to feel guilt because it would seem to me that one is more likely to learn their lesson and change their behavior if they feel regret than if they feel guilt. After all, guilt implies a permanent state, so why make an effort to change? While regret implies a lapse of judgement, so there is every reason to work hard to make better judgements in the future. Just my hunch.

That's my viewpoint, too, Phil.



Our lecture compared it to ingesting poison. If nothing is done, we get sick and die. Inappropriate responses to it are:


Denial: "I didn't take it. I'd NEVER take poison!"
Blame: "Look what so-and-so make me do. Let's get 'em!"
Guilt: "I can't believe I took the poison. That figures. I always seem to do something like that!"


Interesting commentary on one's position, but in the end these types of responses do nothing to help heal oneself of the poison.



How we viewed regret today is the same as acknowledging that one took the poison, and adopted the view that something needs to be done about it. It does no good to grasp onto the fact that poison was ingested, and seeks to find medicine, a doctor, etc. as well as learning to recognize the poison so it can be avoided the next time.



Peace,
Mystic

[Ozzie]

Mystic, this appears to be a very subtle distinction. I don't think these terms guilt and regret label different raw emotions. They do however seem to imply practical consequences in terms of attachment to this emotion. Guilt implies attachment, regret not. The same distinction could apply to pride and hubris. We can let go of pride, but not hubris.

And I think it is a good distinction. Holding onto a stockpile of guilt or excessive pride might not stop action designed to compensate for those feelings. But those actions might be thought of as done for the wrong reasons. Morally for the recipient of an action there is no difference, but the actor can be aware of it.

[MysticSang'ha]

It's interesting to note also Ozzie, that even Merriam-Webster found the distinction, too. The function of guilt is a noun, and the function of regret is a verb. One is being, while the other is doing.



I like your input on the defilement of attachment when it comes to guilt and it's tendencies. This is, obviously, quite the Buddhist thought.



I was kinda hoping there'd be more of a debate on this. Is there anyone who feels that guilt is the better choice between the two?



Peace,
Mystic

[Sunstone]

I agree with J. Krishnamurti that guilt is a wholly useless emotion that, like our wholly useless appendix, can sometimes become inflamed, leading to dire consequences.

[michel]

I was going to say that I thought that guilt was the realisation of having "done wrong", whilst regret is the begining of the "positive journey" to comming to peace about the event (i.e make reparations, ask for forgiveness.......etc)

[Djamila]

In my experience grief is simply a stronger expression of regret. I've regretted things and felt no grief, but I've never felt grief without regret.

With grief, you're always asking yourself questions. "What if I'd gone to find bread that day?" "What if I'd run across the intersection first?" - and you regret some things you might've said, or wish you'd said but didn't.

Regret can be a more daily experience. "Oh, God... how I wish now I didn't have that last chocolate..."