Why do Muslims refer to God as He? (evolve, genesis)

[Booko]

Originally Posted by PREACH THE NETT

That or just another poor attempt by a male dominated society to create a religion with them at the top. I don't know when it comes to you though Booko. What religion do you follow?

I'm a Baha'i. Preach, please go reread my post. I did say that equality of men and women is a cardinal principle, and not just in words but in practice, I think?

It's hardly "a poor attempt by a male dominated society" when said society isn't male dominated, eh?

[lilithu]

Originally Posted by PREACH THE NETT

Just wondering. I know little of the muslim belief. I know why the other religions do already, just curious about muslims.

The same reason why I said "he" when refering to our soon to be new intern in the office. We haven't hired the person yet and I'm not assuming that we'll hire a male, but "he" slipped out by default. I wouldn't refer to the new person as "it," and saying "he or she" all the time gets tedious. I try to do it anyway, but sometimes slip.

Yes, "he" being default is the result of patriarchalism. But it doesn't mean that Allah is male. Every Muslim with whom I've spoken on this subject says that Allah has no gender.

Allah is all. To say that Allah is male would be to limit Allah to only one half of a binary.

[Tigress]

Originally Posted by lilithu

The same reason why I said "he" when refering to our soon to be new intern in the office. We haven't hired the person yet and I'm not assuming that we'll hire a male, but "he" slipped out by default. I wouldn't refer to the new person as "it," and saying "he or she" all the time gets tedious. I try to do it anyway, but sometimes slip.

Yes, "he" being default is the result of patriarchalism. But it doesn't mean that Allah is male. Every Muslim with whom I've spoken on this subject says that Allah has no gender.

Allah is all. To say that Allah is male would be to limit Allah to only one half of a binary.

Exactly. The use of 'he' is simply infused in a great many cultures, and therefore comes naturally to a lot of us, even if one doesn't believe that God has a gender. The pronoun 'he' resonates with a wider audience, and as such, I tend to use it more often than not.

[XAAX]

I wonder if these distinctions are merely that or if we have been programmed for so long by male dominated societies as well as religions to see males as superior. It makes no sense otherwise. Why would a religion if given the choice of words when written would it choose a gender. If you say for convenience wouldn’t it have been just as convenient to choose she?

[TashaN]

Originally Posted by PREACH THE NETT

Thank you truth, this answers my question. Next question: If Allah has no gender, why would he be refered to as a He?

First of all, in islam, we can't question God of what he call himself with. Secondly, there is real difficulties when trying to translate certain attributes of God into english, and "He" is one of them. Just because we used to refer to the male as he and to a female as she, that doesn't dismiss the other options we have including being a "He" or "She" without having a gender as human beings do have.

I think of it as identity more than a gender and for the record, Adam and Eve had no ceratin sexual parts when they were in heaven till it appeared when they ate from the tree. They were a couple of a "He" and "She" as separate identities.

Finally, i think there is no point in discussing these stuff because we don't have the right to say to God, why don't you call yourself a "She".

If i used "She" to talk about someone in here so you will know that i'm talking about a woman but when i try to generalize it will always fit when i talk about a person as a "He" to describe both of the sexes in general but not to specify a gender over another. Usually feminist are obssesed of these things and i don't think of any reason which will make us think that God is a descrimnator or somthing. There is alot of things in life which we can get busy with rather than figuering out why God is "He" but not "She" because that will lead to no where because no one have an answer for that as far as i know, unless you think that a feeble mere human being who dicover new things everyday might be knowledgable more than God himself.

All these are just my thoughts because only Allah knows, but we don't unless he gave us the right to know.

[lilithu]

Originally Posted by PREACH THE NETT

I wonder if these distinctions are merely that or if we have been programmed for so long by male dominated societies as well as religions to see males as superior. It makes no sense otherwise. Why would a religion if given the choice of words when written would it choose a gender. If you say for convenience wouldn’t it have been just as convenient to choose she?

I don't see it as thinking males are superior. I really have no such concept. I do see it as being programmed to think of males as default. Male comes to mind first. And I think that is the result of a culture that historically thinks of males as superior. I'm saying that yes, there is a bias there but not as bad as you think. Otoh, it's probably very hard to get rid of.

Look at our language. Man. Woman. Male. Female. For as long as the word for female is simply the word male with something added to it, we are going to think of male as default. We've been socially conditioned to do so.

[sister M]

Originally Posted by Burchfam

Interestingly it appears that Allah actually had three daughters: Manat, Uzza, and Allat. This is exactly parallel to Wr-alda having the three daughters Lyda, Finda, and Frya.

I have not found in Islamic teachings that there are a connection with Allah SWT and these gods worshiped before the event of Islam. Can you give me the source that confirms your statement?

[Seyorni]

I understand that in many languages, English included, "he" is the proper default mode. But I also feel we're pussyfooting around an uncomfortable social issue.

People conceive of God as a powerful, high-status being. Most people personify their Gods. When depicted, Gods wear clothes, they have legs, eyes, noses and, if Abrahamic, often a beard.

Philosophers and theologians may conceive of God as a formless, sexless, timeless abstraction, perhaps the Sufi's as well, but popular culture imagines a God in the image of a high-status person of their own society or mythology. In an Abrahamic tradition, this image, reflecting the values of society, is male.

[XAAX]

Originally Posted by The Truth

Finally, i think there is no point in discussing these stuff because we don't have the right to say to God, why don't you call yourself a "She".

I beg to differ, I can ask any question of God that I choose and it will be answered. I am just trying to understand why others can’t see the fact that if given the choice, it is obvious why the gender was chosen for reference.
Still the question for you is, if Allah has no gender, why not use "IT"? It would refer to both and neither. I guess the Men who wrote the book didn’t want to give women that much equality. As far as feminist go, they have a good point. The people who tend to miss their point regarding gender fairness are those who are part of the problem. Trust me, I am 100% man, but if it came down to having to choose a gender of God, just for sake of convenience, it would be female. Who brings life into this world…Women…So which gender of the two is more like God…hmmm, Women. Just a thought. It doesn’t surprise me though. All the religions that have stemmed from Judaism have all been male dominant and completely unbalanced. What I don’t get is why the women still by into it.