Is Hell permenant? (punishment, reincarnation, eternal, faith, Satan)

[Dreamwolf]

Originally Posted by beckysoup61

What if it wasn't permenant, would that change your mind at all? What if it was a place to repent of your sins, and then return the Father; something similar to when a child gets grounded, they go to their room, think about what they've done and come back out.

Boy I hope that quote thing worked ...

Anyway ... you description of what Hell could be sounds familiar. I remember reading those characteristics only it was talking about purgatory (sp) not hell. It was believed that if you sinned in life you went to purgatory to live and either repent your sins, or live and prove you could get past the temptations that led you to sin. If you succeeded in this you would end up in Heaven, if not you would end up in Hell for all of eternity. In a manner of speaking, it would be a second chance. I personally don't believe in Hell, at least not the popular deffinition of it at any rate. I think the definition of Hell is very individual, Hell could be anything from breaking a nail to an eternity of burning and paying for sin.

[James the Persian]

Originally Posted by porkchop

Because it says eternal/for ever, not "for ever, but if your good, you can get out" Could i ask, what leads you to say that hell isnt forever, other than what LDS doctrine says? What i mean is, do you see it as only an LDS doctrine or do you see it in the bible?

Actually, it doesn't say eternal at all. The Greek used literally means 'unto the ages of ages', which is usually translated into English as forever and ever or eternally but, in fact, does not preclude at all the possibility of it simply being an extremely long time. This is why Origen (who spoke Greek) felt himself able to teach apokatastasis and why St. Gregory of Nyssa (likewise a Greek speaker) and others have felt able to hope that all might one day be saved. It is always unwise to make dogmatic assertions based on a less than accurate English translation.

Now, I happen to believe that hell is eternal, but that that its nature is rather different from its portrayal in western Christianity. As I believe that heaven and hell are actually different experiences of one and the same thing, it stands to reason that both, or neither, are eternal. The fact that I adhere to the former view doesn't, however, mean that I believe anyone will necessarily suffer in hell eternally. I find myself sharing St. Gregory's hope and even being tempted to follow in the example of St. Isaac the Syrian and pray for the repentance of Satan and his demons, however unlikely that may be.

James

[Dreamwolf]

I thought a bit of humor should be added in this thread so I will tell you all something my mother said about me along time ago (and still says it). She is a dedicated Southern Baptist, she doesn't say it in a mean way, just for humor.

I will be stuck in purgatory forever because Heaven deffinitely won't want you and The Devil would be to scared you would try to take over to let you in.

LOL ... now a good friend found a quote recently that goes "It is better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven." I would happen to agree with that sentiment. I think Heaven would just be to happy for me ... I don't think I could contend with all the brightness and happyness constantly ... it would drive me nuts. I need dark and quiet every so often ...

My personal believe is that when we die our spirits go into a time of rest and recooperation before we are born again. There are simply to many lessons to be learned in life to only have one chance at it!

[darkpenguin]

Originally Posted by Dreamwolf

My personal believe is that when we die our spirits go into a time of rest and recooperation before we are born again. There are simply to many lessons to be learned in life to only have one chance at it!

My idea kind of expands on your idea yet your idea seems to have given me a greater understanding of mine.
I believe that we live the same life over and over until it's got right and that deja vu is brought on by an important decision that was made in a previous life and maybe gotten wrong.
Your idea has given me the link that i needed to get a grasp on what happens until everyone involved in my life dies, if that makes sense.
Thanks alot!

[Kcnorwood]

The punishment of the wicked dead in hell is described throughout Scripture as "everlasting fire" (Matthew 25:41), "unquenchable fire" (Matthew 3:12), "shame and everlasting contempt" (Daniel 12:2), a place where "their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched" (Mark 9:44-49), a place of "torments" and "flame" (Luke 16:23,24), "everlasting destruction" (2 Thessalonians 1:9), a place of torment with "fire and brimstone" where "the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever" (Revelation 14:10,11), and a "lake of fire and brimstone" where the wicked are "tormented day and night forever and ever" (Revelation 20:10). Jesus Himself indicates that the punishment in hell itself is everlasting - not merely the smoke and flames (Matthew 25:46).

Maybe it's just me but the bible I grew up with says hell is forever! It's a pretty open & shut case here. Unless your one of those where someone didn't like what the bible said & they changed it over the years to fit whatever it is they wanted. There is no escpaing from hell in the bible once your there your butt is cooked ( so to speak)

[FFH]

Originally Posted by Kcnorwood

Jesus Himself indicates that the punishment in hell itself is everlasting - not merely the smoke and flames (Matthew 25:46).

Look at the wording Jesus used...

Matthew. 25: 44-46

44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?

45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.



46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment but the rightwous into life eternal.

Everlasting punishment is another way to describe hell, which is eternal, but the punishment affixed for the ones desctibed in verse 44 and 45 in not eternal or everlasting, but has a definite end.

They will not be punished for eternity. Jesus never said this in verse 46. He only said they would go away into (to a place of) everlasting punishment.

[darkpenguin]

I had a thought, how can hell the way religious minded people see it really be that bad? After all why would the 'devil' punish you for doing his bidding on earth?
Either way i'm going to a heaven. that is assuming that i believe in them which i do not!
Guess all those who believe in the heaven=good/hell=bad thing might have it wrong!

[darkpenguin]

Wow I can't believe that nobody can come up with a logical argument against this!