Free Masons - Evil? (ritual, mystic, beliefs, church, pray)

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by Mujahid Mohammed

So Albert Pike one of the greatest and most revered among freemasons is a liar. What about Manley P Hall who is one of the greatest philosophers and most respected amongst Freemasons he is lying. That is like me calling John Smith a liar. I would not do that to you and I would expect you to not to disrespect the most respected philosophers and practictioners. My friend is not a liar he is a freemason and the guy in college is a freemason if they tell me and manly p hall tells me that Freemasonry is a religion and it is on an esoteric and occultic system. You really can not say that Would i tell you I know more about the CLDS than you No. Would you tell me you know more about Islam than I No. I tell you what maybe I need to go through some of these books by the guys and give it to you or I actually have copies of them downloaded on my computer give me an email and I will try and send them to you you can read them yourself.

Whether Freemasonry can be considered a religion is a matter of opinion. I know of Freemasons who don't consider it to be one. Does it incorporate esoteric teachings? Undoubtedly. Does this make it evil or corrupt? Absolutely not. That is the only point I am arguing. No, I would not attempt to tell you that I know more about Islam than you do. But since you're not a Mason, I don't see you as any kind of authority on Freemasonry. And, in my opinion, if a practicing Freemason is divulging privileged information outside of the brotherhood, he has no right to call himself a Freemason. He has broken promises he once made in good faith. To me, that makes him a liar. That's really all I have to say on the subject, except to ask that you not bother to send me any anti-Masonic propoganda. It would be a waste of your time and mine.

[Scarlett Wampus]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

And, in my opinion, if a practicing Freemason is divulging privileged information outside of the brotherhood, he has no right to call himself a Freemason. He has broken promises he once made in good faith. To me, that makes him a liar.

I see an exception to this: If an initiate feels strongly enough that the order they belong to has itself betrayed the good faith in which it claims to have been founded upon then that initiate has a duty to bring it back into alignment. In some situations that may include revealing secrets.

I've personally seen this happen in an organisation whose traditions had strong ties with freemasonry.

[Mujahid Mohammed]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Whether Freemasonry can be considered a religion is a matter of opinion. I know of Freemasons who don't consider it to be one. Does it incorporate esoteric teachings? Undoubtedly. Does this make it evil or corrupt? Absolutely not. That is the only point I am arguing. No, I would not attempt to tell you that I know more about Islam than you do. But since you're not a Mason, I don't see you as any kind of authority on Freemasonry. And, in my opinion, if a practicing Freemason is divulging privileged information outside of the brotherhood, he has no right to call himself a Freemason. He has broken promises he once made in good faith. To me, that makes him a liar. That's really all I have to say on the subject, except to ask that you not bother to send me any anti-Masonic propoganda. It would be a waste of your time and mine.

Wow I never said again anything bad or negative about them. Have i said they are evil or corrupt. No, i did not. It may be for certain institutions or certain individuals maybe but i was not refering to them. Albert pikes book is like the bible to them. When you are initiated at the 32nd degree you are given his book. There is a memorial for him in Washington D.C. at the lodge there. To say you would not read to get knowledge about freemasonry is like saying as a mormon you do not need the book of mormon to understand mormonism. Just because i am not a mason does not mean i do not know any to ask them. I do not want to be a mason. I have been asked and have decided not to choose that path. Bart Erhman is a scholar of a faith he does not believe in does that make his less of an authority. Read Albert pikes book morals and dogma or Manly p. Halls the secret teachings of all ages and some of his other books on freemasonry and esoteric teachings. They are definitely NON ANTI MASONIC. This is the info i am refering to. Again all i ever said is that people do not know in the lower levels what goes on in the higher. Ask any mason who is going through the rites whether Scottish or York rite if his worshipful master will reveal any of the rites between them. Are there masons who are evil and corrupt Maybe. Are they most of the mason we know, Probably not. My buddy tells me less then 10 percent go beyond the 3rd degree. So a major majority of them are still in the dark about really what there organization is. i was not gonna send you anti masonic material, also off the subject but my friend has been my friend almost my whole life. There are things he has told me he has not told his wife. Do you not have friends who confide in you or seek your counsel because they know you. Do you not talk about things they are interested in. My friend is a freemason and with all the things going on today it is often the topic of discussion.

[Mujahid Mohammed]

Originally Posted by Scarlett Wampus

I see an exception to this: If an initiate feels strongly enough that the order they belong to has itself betrayed the good faith in which it claims to have been founded upon then that initiate has a duty to bring it back into alignment. In some situations that may include revealing secrets.

I've personally seen this happen in an organisation whose traditions had strong ties with freemasonry.

i could not agree more. Morals and values sometimes take precedence over your loyaly to someperson or organization.

[Ðanisty]

Here is a very interesting essay about Albert Pike and his importance in Freemasonry. Apparently, he's actually not that important and only anti-Mason people ever reference his writings.

http://www.masonicinfo.com/pike.htm

[Mujahid Mohammed]

Originally Posted by Ðanisty

Here is a very interesting essay about Albert Pike and his importance in Freemasonry. Apparently, he's actually not that important and only anti-Mason people ever reference his writings.

http://www.masonicinfo.com/pike.htm

Did you read the whole article at the bottom it clearly states how he is significant. Why would a man who is not important have a memorial for him in the middle of Washington D.C.

[Mystic-als]

using your stats of 10% of masons ever go past 3rd degree. I would wonder how commited you have to be to get too say 30 (scottish rite). It is true that Masons have a huge secrecy around their ceremonies and brotherhood. But any mason can say he is one. But revealing any part of any ceremony to a non-mason is strickty prohibited. Even to life long buddies. If you friends Mason brothers found out he could be kicked out of masonry.
This type of secrecy is what people are afraid of. "What are they not telling us?" "What do they know?" "Do they have the ancient templar knowledge?" "Do they ride tri-cycles around the checkered floor?"
I don't know. But the higher up I go I will find out.
And if I get to 33rd and they ride tri-cycles around I will join them and not tell you.
Because you don't have the right to know. Unless you are in the temple with me. As a brother.

[almifkhar]

mysticals
i will give you two sites. one is a streetmap of washington d.c. and the other one is an article on freemasons and how they are evil, and have a plan. the article does however, have a christian bend, but i thought it was interesting none the less. my personal opinion is that they are evil because like on rf'er (cannot remember name of person sorry) posted a quote from albert pike, and he i think pretty much sums it up with his own words, not to mention, the d.c. map is pretty freeky me thinks. judge for youself, but read the article and check out the map for the heck of it.
www.cremationofcare.com//illu_molech.htm
www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/masonic_symbols_washington.htm
enjoy the read. i did find both of these sites very interesting and i agree the symbolism is quite strange.

oh, when the british left yemen, one of the first things the yemeni government did was burn down the mason hall, and then went and banned freemasons from the country. it could be they did this because the brits brought it, or it could be that it is indeed evil?

[almifkhar]

mysticals
sorry i almost forgot, a book i can refer you to is called

"THE SECERT DESTINY OF AMERICA" - MANLY P. HALL 33 DEG. MASON

Here are a few quotes from the book
"the rise of american democracy was neccessary to a world program. at the appointed hour, the freedom of man was publically declared."

"not only were many of the founders of the united states government masons, but they recieved aid from a secret and august body existing in europe which helped them establish this country for a peculiar and paticular purpose known only to a few initiated few."

note, this guy has writen one of the best occult history books i have ever read called the secret of all ages.