Vegetarians and vegans and questions thereon (moral, blood, evolve, creation)

[Prima]

Actually we have devolved from our evolutionary potential in this regard. As Adam and all the first human's were all following an Edenic diet of Veganism, it was only later that man went against his/her nature and introduced flesh into his diet.

Erm...hmm. Well, I suppose that that depends on what you believe. For one thing, there is no such thing as 'devolution' It's an incorrect term. For another, mankind hunted before he gathered before he planted. Going to a meatless diet is a sign of advance - it's related to levels of conciousness. You have the ability to consider what it is you're eating, AND choose not to eat it. It's also an advanced form of empathy - empathizing with a cow is more advanced than empathizing with a human being.

[michel]

God (in my faith) populated the world by ensuring that there was a simbiotic relationship between animals, reptiles, birds - every form of life on Earth.

I too have a knee-jerk reaction to eating meat; I watch a programme on the television in the morning which is devoted to following animals in wild game reserves - at the moment, it is centered on the one in Kenya (Sorry old name for the same country; I cannot get used to African countries changing names like I do socks). My wife adores the programme too, people with videocams follow a pack of hienas, one of lions and also leopards.
My wife always has to turn her head away when a lion or lioness catches up with a gazelle. That is nature.
NaturalSubmission PART QUOTE[Remember, MAN is responsible for breeding all this livestock, otherwise there probably wouldn't be such a huge population]
Er, I think you'll find that animals are quite capable of doing that without our help; indeed it is often the human being who has 'messed up' the originally well designed balance of nature.
Having invented pesticides and having killed off loads of bugs, we suddenly realized that God had already thought about keeping the balance of nature (And in a damn sight better way than we ever could)- now that we learned that hard lesson, we are slowly trying to reintroduce bugs to eat other bugs....etc, so as to get food that is hopefully a lot better for us. Like it or not, nature is not 'pretty' in the way it deals with the foodchain. What makes us think we are above the laws of nature?

[Prima]

^ About the natural balance bit...if you're in the South, take a look at kudzu. That was introduced to 'stop' a problem that we had created in the first place

[Seyorni]

I've heard this question about how we'd manage the herds of livestock if we stopped eating them many times, and it has always baffled me. The questioners evidently think the livestock are some sort of natural phenomenon that would continue to exist if people stopped breeding them. What a bizarre delusion! How can someone fail to understand that we create these animals just as we once created whalebone corsets, buggy-whips and model A Fords; that without our active management these beast's situation would be precisely that of the buggy-whips?

[Natural Submission]

Originally Posted by Prima

Erm...hmm. Well, I suppose that that depends on what you believe. For one thing, there is no such thing as 'devolution' It's an incorrect term. For another, mankind hunted before he gathered before he planted. Going to a meatless diet is a sign of advance - it's related to levels of conciousness. You have the ability to consider what it is you're eating, AND choose not to eat it. It's also an advanced form of empathy - empathizing with a cow is more advanced than empathizing with a human being.

As man was created as an evolved creature, he began with a plant based diet IN EDEN. Upon coming to Earth was man led astray, but that's another story. i understand your point, being a vegan IS a higher station of consciousness that mankind needs to return to.

Forward to Eden.

[standing_on_one_foot]

This was also when Adam and Eve were running around naked and didn't know right from wrong. Higher state of conciousness? Being vegan may be the right thing to do, based on various environmental and humane reasons, but I fail to see how Adam and Eve's diet plays into it. As long as we're going Biblical, the Tanach seems pretty clear that eating meat is alright, at least certain kinds of meat. Heck, there's a great deal about animal sacrifice, if it comes to that. Although, perhaps you're implying that this was part of the leading astray?

[Quoth The Raven]

I'm doing my part...eating a steak right now.

'Combat The Bovine Infestation: Eat a Cow Today!'

[Quoth The Raven]

Originally Posted by Natural Submission

As man was created as an evolved creature, he began with a plant based diet IN EDEN.

No, man evolved to what he is today, and continues to evolve.
Check out the fossil record some time.

[Halcyon]

Does it say in the OT that adam and eve were vegan?

If you look at the length of our gut you will see that it is not long enough to properly digest vegetable matter, it is far better suited to meat and fruit. In fact it was the greater amount of energy that our early ancestors received from meat that allowed our brains to grow large enough that we can now contemplate whether eating meat is right or wrong.