Gun Control (punishment, Zen)

[Aasimar]

Originally Posted by stephenw

Cool. Why not start a new thread when you're ready? I can pass on plenty about Switzerland too, we spend a good bit of time there.

Heyas, this thread got started in another thread which you can find here:

What kind of statement are shopping mall murderers trying to make?

But It is veering away from the OP and turning into a debate about Gun Control, so I figured I'd move it here. This thread is basically to discuss your views on Gun Control, more specifically the U.S. Constitutional right to bear arms but also other countries policies on firearms and how effective, unaffective different methods can be. In my own opinion, the right to bear arms is quite important and removing guns from people is treating the symptom and not the problem. I guess I'll throw down some little factoids to get this started:

Amendment II (U.S. Bill of Rights)

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Though I think that's pretty obviously saying that people can have arms, many people take different views, so we can discuss that.

I don't want to make this post ridiculously lengthy, so I'll post some relevent links

United States vs. Jack Miller
United States v. Miller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

George Lewis vs. United States
LEWIS v. UNITED STATES.

Worldwide Homicide Rates with Firearms
Gun violence - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So, guns. Where do you stand and why?

[stephenw]

Originally Posted by Aasimar

So, guns. Where do you stand and why?

This country has an unarmed police force. Private gun ownership is uncommon. I think these two factors benefit our society.

[davidishere]

Only police officer should be able to have guns. Otherwise if a person with the intention of murder or another crime had the ability to obtain guns with ease, it will make their cause easier to achieve.

[stephenw]

Regarding the Swiss issuing arms to their citizens, they have a citizen army. They don't pass around guns. Military weapons are tightly controlled,you can't just head for the woods with your army gun.

[Terrywoodenpic]

What ever any bill of rights may say, I can see no sense in permitting civilians to carry arms.
I would make the punishment for carrying arms of any sort, immediate and severe.
IF they are carried whilst committing a crime also, immediate, and added to a double sentence normal for the crime.

By immediate I mean any one found in possession of arms either on them in their vehicle or at home, should go straight to jail, with out the option of bail, and tried from there.

A tough law like that would soon remove most arms from circulation.

[Aasimar]

Not to try to sound like the old wise man who can trounce all other viewpoints with a clever phrase, but "In the land where guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns."

[michel]

Originally Posted by Terrywoodenpic

What ever any bill of rights may say, I can see no sense in permitting civilians to carry arms.
I would make the punishment for carrying arms of any sort, immediate and severe.
IF they are carried whilst committing a crime also, immediate, and added to a double sentence normal for the crime.

By immediate I mean any one found in possession of arms either on them in their vehicle or at home, should go straight to jail, with out the option of bail, and tried from there.

A tough law like that would soon remove most arms from circulation.

I agree wholeheartedly.

[Terrywoodenpic]

Originally Posted by Aasimar

Not to try to sound like the old wise man who can trounce all other viewpoints with a clever phrase, but "In the land where guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns."

True ... but now most deaths are caused by people who own guns under the law.
we still have a few people killed by guns in the UK ... but they are very few and far between... and most are west Indian gang members against each other, they are about the only major group that carries Guns as a norm here.

The advantage of the Idea of an immediate incarceration would introduce a new element of fear for the criminal... as now they can be held on bail for years, still active as criminals. They can even argue a gun found at home is legal.

[Reverend Rick]

Passing more laws does not solve the problem of people who have already broken hundreds of laws. Will one more law change anything? Punishment does little either when a person plans on killing themselves.

My only regret about the mall shooting this week is that someone did not have a gun available to end the shooting spree quickly.