Homosexuality - Choice or Not? (mystic, celibacy, procreation, choices)

[madhatter85]

Because this matter comes up alot recently, i thought i would take a moment to post something i replied with in a thread that i think is a good topic for a Debate.

Let me state this here and now -
I do not have a problem with people who consider themselves Homosexual.
I do have a problem with homosexual acts.
I do not have a problem with Homosexual equal rights as individual citizens of the United States.
I do have a problem with Marriage for Homosexual couples.
Civil unions, sure, fine, go for it. but, it should be kept separate from marriage.

I'm not opposed to equal rights for you guys, just as everyone should have equal rights as an individual. I don't agree that you guys should be barred from hospital visits for eachother, proper burials or memorials ect...

it's just the marriage thing. no tax breaks shoudl be given, nothing, because there is no way you can reproduce being a homosexual couple. you have nothing to contribute to the procreation of the human race. you might try to throw out there that there are "barren" couples who are hederosexual but that is completely different, those people had no choice in the matter. Then again theres the argument that homosexuals always say "it wasn't our choice to be this way." yes it is, you have a choice to do everything, you weren't born that way, you decided it yourself.

some people have sexual urges toward somethign or another, but it is Always thier choice to act on it. (e.g. pedophiles, adulters, rapists) even things on a non, sexual nature, physical violence for example, peopel control thier anger even though they have violent urges. here i'm talkign about choices and urges.

Then they say "But we can adopt" sure of course you can, but where did that baby come from? a hederosexual couple who couldn't/did want to take care of it.

Civil union, sure go ahead and have it, so that you can be a "couple" if you will but not under the flag of marriage. and it should be completely different and separate from the term, aspect, or side of marriage.

[Buttercup]

Oh boy....I think I'll stay out of this thread (at least I'm gonna try ) . We just finished one very similar, Madhatter.

Is Being Gay Ok If You're Born That Way?

[Sunstone]

Instead of simply speculating wildly on this subject, why don't you study the current science on it?

[Jaymes]

I didn't chose to be straight. Why would it be reasonable for me to think that being gay is any more of a choice than it was for me to be straight?

You also miss (or don't care) that civil unions don't provide the same benefits as marriage at all. If you support equal rights for GLB citizens, you should by definition support gay marriage--or support getting the government out of marriage altogether, as I know some people do.

[standing_alone]

Originally Posted by Sunstone

Instead of simply speculating wildly on this subject, why don't you study the current science on it?

Because studying the current science on it would probably make dearly-held prejudices and the inequality of LGBT citizens less justifiable and God knows we wouldn't want that.

[madhatter85]

why not use common sense and reason rather than doing years of research to try an justify something?

[Bishka]

Originally Posted by madhatter85

why not use common sense and reason rather than doing years of research to try an justify something?

Because research has provable facts.

And peoples "supposed" common sense varies - they are not just trying to justify something. They are really trying to see whether homosexuality is from birth or if people chose to be that way.

[MysticSang'ha]

Originally Posted by madhatter85

Because this matter comes up alot recently, i thought i would take a moment to post something i replied with in a thread that i think is a good topic for a Debate.

Let me state this here and now -
I do not have a problem with people who consider themselves Homosexual.
I do have a problem with homosexual acts.
I do not have a problem with Homosexual equal rights as individual citizens of the United States.
I do have a problem with Marriage for Homosexual couples.
Civil unions, sure, fine, go for it. but, it should be kept separate from marriage.

You know, vows of celibacy in the heterosexual population is always voluntary. How strange that it should be somehow enforced in the GLBTQ community.




Peace,
Mystic

[madhatter85]

Originally Posted by Jaymes

I didn't chose to be straight. Why would it be reasonable for me to think that being gay is any more of a choice than it was for me to be straight?

You also miss (or don't care) that civil unions don't provide the same benefits as marriage at all. If you support equal rights for GLB citizens, you should by definition support gay marriage--or support getting the government out of marriage altogether, as I know some people do.

Because, look at physical anatomy, Women and Men are different in thier structure, they are designed by nature to do a certian function together(procreation). why would it be natural to go against nature?

a man and a man cannot make new life
just as a woman and a woman cannot make new life

[Ðanisty]

I voted "no I was born this way" which is okay since I'm bisexual, but I would recommend changing the wording on the poll. People other than homosexuals do have an opinion on this issue. I think it should read "no, homosexuals are born that way." What say you? Do you mind if I change the wording?