The UK really better off without guns? (virgin, America, Article)

[Bishka]

Originally Posted by article

Stab-proof hoodies on sale An Essex firm is making stab-proof hoodies lined with Kevlar, the material used in body armour for British troops.


Romford-based Bladerunner, which makes protective clothes for police forces and security guards, is selling the tops for £65.


Boss Adrian Davis claims to be in discussion with schools in east London about putting Kevlar linings into school uniforms.


"It's all in development but we're at an advanced stage," he said.


"We've sent examples of school jumpers to the manufacturers and we're waiting for the costings. I really believe it's needed," he told The Sun.


His colleague Barry Samms says a policeman friend has come across 14 and 15-year-olds wearing stab-proof vests for protection on the streets.

Link here

Early this week we had a 'debate' with a member of the UK here and this member insisted the the UK was better off without guns. I ran across this article today and it gave me another picture.

There were a few things that bothered me 1) Kevlar in school uniforms and 2)that this officer has come across 14/15 year olds on the streets of the UK wearing stab-proof vests.

So, is the UK really safe? I don't EVER have to worry about having to wear 'stab-proof' vests, because it's really not that dangerous here. I could walk around my city of 18,000 (residents) and 12,000 (college students) at three a.m. in the morning and the only trouble I would run into would be a police officer asking me to return to my home because I'm breaking curfew; other then that, it might be a few stray dogs and a tumbleweed.

What do you think?

[Buttercup]

The UK has the worst drug problem in Europe. It's probably a good idea to wear a stab proof vest so the drug dealers can't stick ya when you stiff 'em. If they had guns the drug dealers would be shooting them instead, of that I'm sure.

[Guitar's Cry]

That information seems to indicate that rather than guns, those in England that wish to be violent use knives.

Knives are, at least, slightly easier to defend against than a gun. But I'm wondering how having guns here in America is supposed to keep violence down. How often is it that someone is able to defend themselves with a gun on the street? In most places, weapons permits are needed to carry. How many citizens actually do? I would understand it if everyone carried, but only a few probably actually carry a gun in public.

[Mike182]

Originally Posted by beckysoup61

Link here

Early this week we had a 'debate' with a member of the UK here and this member insisted the the UK was better off without guns. I ran across this article today and it gave me another picture.

There were a few things that bothered me 1) Kevlar in school uniforms and 2)that this officer has come across 14/15 year olds on the streets of the UK wearing stab-proof vests.

So, is the UK really safe? I don't EVER have to worry about having to wear 'stab-proof' vests, because it's really not that dangerous here. I could walk around my city of 18,000 (residents) and 12,000 (college students) at three a.m. in the morning and the only trouble I would run into would be a police officer asking me to return to my home because I'm breaking curfew; other then that, it might be a few stray dogs and a tumbleweed.

What do you think?

likewise Becky, i live in one of the small towns outside of Nottingham city, we're 3rd for most crime rates (gun crime, knife crime etc) but i have only a few times been threatened with physical violence that didn't involve weapons, and it was guys from my school.

but this article isn't going on about the quiet places in the UK, or the UK in general, it's going on about a school in the middle of London, with the highest crime rates for gun and knife crime, and school kids do get mixed up with that! i think it's great that the school is considering this, if it saves but one innocent kid who got caught in the middle then it would have been worth it, and the sense of protection will undoubtedly be welcomed by some of the kids.

but i fail to see how this adds anything to the debate that came up earlier though. all it does is prove that there is crime in our capital city and the kids there are not as safe as we'd like to think kids should be. that doesn't put UK on par with America for crime rates though.

[Ozzie]

Originally Posted by beckysoup61

Link here

Early this week we had a 'debate' with a member of the UK here and this member insisted the the UK was better off without guns. I ran across this article today and it gave me another picture.

There were a few things that bothered me 1) Kevlar in school uniforms and 2)that this officer has come across 14/15 year olds on the streets of the UK wearing stab-proof vests.

So, is the UK really safe? I don't EVER have to worry about having to wear 'stab-proof' vests, because it's really not that dangerous here. I could walk around my city of 18,000 (residents) and 12,000 (college students) at three a.m. in the morning and the only trouble I would run into would be a police officer asking me to return to my home because I'm breaking curfew; other then that, it might be a few stray dogs and a tumbleweed.

What do you think?

Why do you need curfew? The US has many more deaths per million residents from gun incidents than comparable Western nations. Russia exceeds the US now for gun danger, in Communist times however it was much safer. The student who killed 31 at Virginia Tech obtained two weapons easily and legally. In Australia, he might have fantasised just as much about committing the crime, but would have had more difficulty committing it.

The real question you should be asking is why is it a functional "right" to bear arms in an environment that was long ago tamed by White man and subjected to his law?

[Phil Osophy]

Recently in the UK there have been several gun and knife murders involving young people. These hit the headlines, and some parents perhaps overreacted. There again,perhaps a knife-proof garment is a wise precaution in a few parts of the UK. Things need to be kept in proportion though. A few years ago there were about 28 firearm related deaths each year in the UK, and about 28,000 in the USA. Currently the figures are about 50 in the UK and still around 28,000 in the USA. I think that these are the total number of gun related deaths and not just those associated with gun-crime. A pretty huge difference even if you allow for the fact that the USA has a population which is about five times that of the UK. I have lived in the UK for over 50 years and have never actually seen a handgun.

[Reverend Rick]

I guess it depends if you think handguns are the problem or the people who use them are the real problem. I guess it depends if you are worried about accidental discharges or mass murders.

If you want to give a gunman a tactical advantage because he will be unopossed, I question the sanity of this mindset. Actually a terrorist has the advantage in gun free zones. Look at the situation on 9/11. The terrorist were able to accomplish their goals with box cutters.

This is a security issue, not a gun issue. If you can insure my safety, I am fine with any no gun laws. The question is, who is in charge of every one's safety and if we are provided with the level of protection necessary.

Where I get upset is when I am not adequately protected. If I am not going to be protected by proper security, then I want the ability to protect myself. I would rather be protected by highly trained professionals than have to rely on my own abilities.

I have a question. When the UK first started their gun laws, diamond merchants and banker gentlemen where still permitted to have hand guns. This is not the case any more. Why did the UK take the gentleman's guns? Did they abuse their privilege or was there any tragic consequences of those men having weapons?

[darkpenguin]

It's hardly surprising that there is high crime in London Becky, the place is the capital and it's frickin huge so there are no surprises there.

The point I was making about the guns was that there have been no masacres here since the banning of them.

And yes this country is in a real mess which we have Mr. Blair to thank for but then again what can you really expect from a leader when he seems to care more about countries that arn't his own (which I'm sure you can sympathise with!).

All I can say is role on the next election as this labour boy recently turned conservative!

[darkpenguin]

And hey I'm fine with the young 'gangsters' over here shooting and stabbing each other, IMO they are doing the good people of Britain a huge favour!