Battle for Hearts and Minds. (Jesus, America, experience, pagan)

[Ozzie]

I never felt comfortable with the expression "Battle for Hearts and Minds" used to describe the job foreign forces were engaging in within post-Saddam Iraq. To me, this phrase has an evangelistic zeal about it likely to make Iraqis suspicious of intent. On the other hand, some might find it reassuring as a description of the job the Armed Forces are engaged because it has a connotation of doing good work.

Is "Battle for Hearts and Minds" a good way of describing military operations in Iraq? Do you find it reassuring? Why?

Are you comfortable with your Armed Forces being employed for engagement in a Battle for Hearts and Minds on foreign soil?

[Guitar's Cry]

Originally Posted by Ozzie

I never felt comfortable with the expression "Battle for Hearts and Minds" used to describe the job foreign forces were engaging in within post-Saddam Iraq. To me, this phrase has an evangelistic zeal about it likely to make Iraqis suspicious of intent. On the other hand, some might find it reassuring as a description of the job the Armed Forces are engaged because it has a connotation of doing good work.

Is "Battle for Hearts and Minds" a good way of describing military operations in Iraq? Do you find it reassuring? Why?

Are you comfortable with your Armed Forces being employed for engagement in a Battle for Hearts and Minds on foreign soil?

What do they mean? Whose hearts and minds are they battling for? The Iraqi's?

I think it's simply an empty slogan used by those wishing to justify a war that no one believes in anymore. While I agree that the hearts and minds of oppressed people are worth battling for, must the battle always be physical?

If we must battle for hearts and minds in Iraq, what about elsewhere? I guess I question the intent...

By fighting a militiristic battle, we are trading hearts and minds for lives. If we must battle for them, let us battle with our hearts and minds until a military option is really needed.

[Booko]

Originally Posted by Ozzie

I never felt comfortable with the expression "Battle for Hearts and Minds" used to describe the job foreign forces were engaging in within post-Saddam Iraq. To me, this phrase has an evangelistic zeal about it likely to make Iraqis suspicious of intent.

The Iraqis already have plenty of reasons to be suspicious, and nevermind mentioning the idea of a Battle for Hearts and Minds. They have plenty of experience in colonialism and its methods, thanks to their history with the Brits.

On the other hand, some might find it reassuring as a description of the job the Armed Forces are engaged because it has a connotation of doing good work.

Or, alternately, it has the connotation of being associated with psy ops and propaganda.

Is "Battle for Hearts and Minds" a good way of describing military operations in Iraq? Do you find it reassuring? Why?

I'm not comfortable with the use of "War" and "Battle" when applied to serious problems that need to be worked on, no matter what the subject. War on Poverty. War on Drugs. War on Terror. (Have we ever won any of these "Wars"? Hm...)

Have you noticed that whenever someone wants us to mindlessly get behind some idea, they call it a "war" and get us to march off somewhere? It has the tendency to shut off dialogue, understanding, and consultation, which are the way to real, long-lasting solutions.

Are you comfortable with your Armed Forces being employed for engagement in a Battle for Hearts and Minds on foreign soil?

I have no idea why we're there, other than to project our power into that region of the world, provide a check on Iranian and Syrian power, ensure access to oil, and *maybe* to quell sectarian violence, but the latter is quite debatable. If we could achieve the former goals in the presence of sectarian violence, I doubt our policy makers would give a rat's ear if the sectarians were busy killing each other.

I'm not comfortable with our Armed Forces being used to support American hegemony, no matter how benign our methods.

[lunamoth]

Originally Posted by Ozzie

I never felt comfortable with the expression "Battle for Hearts and Minds" used to describe the job foreign forces were engaging in within post-Saddam Iraq. To me, this phrase has an evangelistic zeal about it likely to make Iraqis suspicious of intent. On the other hand, some might find it reassuring as a description of the job the Armed Forces are engaged because it has a connotation of doing good work.

Is "Battle for Hearts and Minds" a good way of describing military operations in Iraq? Do you find it reassuring? Why?

Are you comfortable with your Armed Forces being employed for engagement in a Battle for Hearts and Minds on foreign soil?

When I hear this phrase I think it is acknowledging that the main problem we (US troops) have in Iraq is one of trust. That's part of the reason this situation is so far intractable. I have no idea what the best course of action would be at this point.

luna

[Ozzie]

Originally Posted by Booko

The Iraqis already have plenty of reasons to be suspicious, and nevermind mentioning the idea of a Battle for Hearts and Minds. They have plenty of experience in colonialism and its methods, thanks to their history with the Brits.


Or, alternately, it has the connotation of being associated with psy ops and propaganda.


I'm not comfortable with the use of "War" and "Battle" when applied to serious problems that need to be worked on, no matter what the subject. War on Poverty. War on Drugs. War on Terror. (Have we ever won any of these "Wars"? Hm...)

Have you noticed that whenever someone wants us to mindlessly get behind some idea, they call it a "war" and get us to march off somewhere? It has the tendency to shut off dialogue, understanding, and consultation, which are the way to real, long-lasting solutions.


I have no idea why we're there, other than to project our power into that region of the world, provide a check on Iranian and Syrian power, ensure access to oil, and *maybe* to quell sectarian violence, but the latter is quite debatable. If we could achieve the former goals in the presence of sectarian violence, I doubt our policy makers would give a rat's ear if the sectarians were busy killing each other.

I'm not comfortable with our Armed Forces being used to support American hegemony, no matter how benign our methods.

Great comments. The phrase "Battle for Hearts and Minds" gives me cultural cringe by association.

[Comprehend]

the phrase appears in the bible,

Originally Posted by bible

philippians 4:7
And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.

and the earliest military reference I can find to it is from General Arthur MacArthur (father of Douglas MacArthur)

Originally Posted by website

the more objective General Arthur MacArthur (father of Douglas MacArthur). Military action was accompanied by a "hearts and minds" campaign that included education, fiscal reform, and civil construction projects.

answers.com link

personally I think the phrase acurately describes what the military objective is regardless of how we may feel about it. The US believes they must convince the Iraqi's that they can suceed on their own and inspire them to work for it. Obviously from the results we have seen in Iraq, this is easier said than done.