Foley is clean? (suicide, sex)

[Ciscokid]

Unless flirting with underage people is a crime then I suppose Foley didn't really do anything wrong.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/...t_to_find.html

[CaptainXeroid]

After interviewing some 40 former congressional pages, FBI agents have yet to turn up any evidence of direct sexual contact between underage pages and former Congressman Mark Foley...

Emphasis mine. I guess if there is a silver lining it's that he apparently did not actually engage in sex acts with minors.

...Former prosecutors and FBI agents who have worked on similar cases say, depending on the prosecutor, the instant messages contain more than enough material to bring a charge of soliciting sex over the Internet...

I think it's clear that Foley did a horrible thing 'flirting' with underage people on line. He may have even violated laws related to 'cyber crimes'.

[kateyes]

Well it sounds to me like it was a more than flirting--it was certainly in questionable taste--probably abusing his power as a Congressman, but as far as illegal actions there don't seem to have been any. It appears when sexual relations occurred the person was over 18 AND no longer a page--in other words the participants were of legal age and were not coerced or forced to participate. Should he have resigned his position--yes I believe so--is there anything to prosecute not so far--in addition I would like to remind people this is not the 1st time this has occurred--and NO legal charges were brought in the 2 incidents in the past--and in those cases the pages were under the age of consent. The following is from Wikipedia:

The 1983 Congressional Page sex scandal was a political scandal in the United States involving members of the United States House of Representatives.
On July 14, 1983 the House Ethics Committee concluded that Rep. Dan Crane (R-Ill.) and Rep. Gerry Studds (D-Mass.) had engaged in sexual relationships with minors, specifically 17-year-old congressional pages. In Crane's case, it was a 1980 relationship with a female page and in Studds's case, it was a 1973 relationship with a male page. Both representatives immediately admitted to the charges and the committee recommended reprimand for the two.
However, Rep. Newt Gingrich (R-Ga.) demanded their expulsion. On July 20, 1983, the House voted for censure nearly unanimously, the first time that censure had been imposed for sexual misconduct. Crane, who subsequently apologized for his transgression, lost his bid for reelection in 1984.
Studds admitted "an error in judgment." While Studds has often been reported as having "turned his back on the House" as the House read its censure motion aloud, contemporary reports made it clear that in contrast to Crane, who faced the House as the motion for his censure was read, Studds faced the Speaker who was actually reading the motion, with his back to the other members. Also in contrast to Crane, who left the chamber after his censure, Studds rejoined the other members of the House after his censure was read. He called a press conference with the former page, in which both stated that the young man, who was 17, consented. Studds, who had been 36 at the time, claimed he did not break any U.S. laws in what he called a "private relationship." He continued to be reelected until his retirement in 1996.

Neither of these gentlemen resigned, neither had charges brought against them--and 1 of them continued to be reelected. I am not saying what any of them did is right--I am having some difficulty with the idea that the 2 earlier men went unscathed--and Mark Foley is being investigated by the FBI.

[Ciscokid]

Originally Posted by CaptainXeroid

Emphasis mine. I guess if there is a silver lining it's that he apparently did not actually engage in sex acts with minors.

I think it's clear that Foley did a horrible thing 'flirting' with underage people on line. He may have even violated laws related to 'cyber crimes'.

I think what makes this a rough situation is the position that Foley held. Other than that, if he was an average Joe I really don't think he did much wrong. The guy did hold out until the young men were of age....I personally think he's ok in my book.

According to what I've seen on Dateline...they don't consider it a crime unless the person actually shows intent to have sex with a minor. I don't think that can be said in Foley's case. He could have had sex but he didn't.

[Booko]

Originally Posted by kateyes

Neither of these gentlemen resigned, neither had charges brought against them--and 1 of them continued to be reelected. I am not saying what any of them did is right--I am having some difficulty with the idea that the 2 earlier men went unscathed--and Mark Foley is being investigated by the FBI.

It's possible that Foley is being investigated for any or all of the following reasons:

1. The GOP, this close to an election, has to look serious about dealing with issues of protection for children. To let this one slide would be political suicide, and they were having problems before all this.

2. Hypocrisy. Foley was very active in the whole thing about protecting children from online predators.

3. Times have changed. With all the child sex abuse scandals that have happened since the original page scandal, the public seems to be very intolerant of any hint of abuse.*


*Did you see the story about some other Congressman who went camping with some pages? The story didn't have any legs, but it still was floating around for 2 days. In the meantime, the Congressman (whose name I don't remember) was probably sweating bullets wondering if his reputation was going to be ruined over nothing. Apparently he had gone camping with pages, but they were all sleeping in the open as a group. If there had been any funny business, it would be hard not to notice. That story probably shouldn't have been out there in the first place.

[Faint]

Originally Posted by Ciscokid

According to what I've seen on Dateline...they don't consider it a crime unless the person actually shows intent to have sex with a minor. I don't think that can be said in Foley's case. He could have had sex but he didn't.

I think I saw that episode. That's the one where they set up a sting at the "child's" house and had the feds bust anyone who showed up?

[Ciscokid]

Originally Posted by kateyes

Neither of these gentlemen resigned, neither had charges brought against them--and 1 of them continued to be reelected. I am not saying what any of them did is right--I am having some difficulty with the idea that the 2 earlier men went unscathed--and Mark Foley is being investigated by the FBI.

Yeah exactly! I think what Foley did was shameful but not criminal.

[Booko]

Originally Posted by Ciscokid

I think what makes this a rough situation is the position that Foley held. Other than that, if he was an average Joe I really don't think he did much wrong. The guy did hold out until the young men were of age....I personally think he's ok in my book.

What he did was the zenith of unprefessional. That makes him not ok in my book.

I expect adults to act like responsible adults. Especially "leaders."

I don't care what their politics are, if politicos act like irresponsible children or frat boys, they will not be getting my vote.

I can't for the life of me see how I can teach my children to be responsible while at the same time supporting some goombah that doesn't know enough not to send naughty emails to people (even adults) over work equipment during work hours.