Profanity (moral, Earth, elder, experience, Christian)

[Fluffy]

Firstly, although this thread is about swearing, I want to remind everyone that the use of any profanities shouldn't be necessary and is against forum rules.

Most people in society have a largely negative view of swearing. These views cover the full range from immoral to rude/offensive to inconsiderate to merely inappropriate. Additionally, the common feeling is that a person who swears is of inferior intelligence or has a more meague range of vocabulary to express themselves.

For me, this is yet another throwback from Christian Europe of old along with negative attitudes towards sex, women, otherness and a whole host of things that have mostly been hit over the head with a healthy dose of reason in our modern world. However, this blow of rationality seems to have totally skipped over these rather unfounded and unsupported views towards certain aspects of our language.

Therefore, I would like to try and put the best case forward for why swearing is not a bad thing at all and to be offended by it is irrational.

So firstly lets try and identify exactly what the negative component of swearing is. As far as I can see it must either be the word itself, the meaning behind the word, the impact which the word has upon the listener or the context in which the word is said.

By the word itself, I am referring to the specific construction of letters that make up the word and the way it sounds. This one is easy to refute. If there was something intrinsically wrong with the word then people should find something equally wrong with foreign swear words. Additionally, there appears to be no pattern amongst swear words in terms of their spelling or sound. If this was a factor of the swearing's negativity then one would expect both some sort of similarity between the words and secondly offense to be taken at words which sound similar. However, there are plenty of different words that sound similar to swear words and yet are not considered offensive.

The meaning of the word is also easy to refute. If there was something intrinsically taboo about the meaning then people would have the same reaction to that meaning regardless of what word was used to refer to it. However, this is not the case since there are plenty of "neutral" words which people deliberately adopt in order to avoid using swear words for example "sex" or "phallus". Additionally, English is only one of a few languages in which its swear words surround sexual topics. Since there is no real difference between English speaking cultures and many non-English speaking cultures regarding attitudes towards sex, this disproportionate amount of sexual swear words indicates that the meaning behind these words is not actual offensive.

Many of these words have also come to have alternative meanings that are just some variety of general negative. However, this does not mean that they in themselves should be considered as offensive or wrong. Nobody considers the word "stupid" or "bad" offensive although they would be well within their rights to take that attitude if the words were used to describe them. The same should surely be applied to swear words?

I am all for protecting a person's sensibilities when they are rational. If somebody insults you then you have a right to feel insulted. If I swear as an exclamative or referring to something which you have no emotional attachment to, then by what reasoning do you feel offended by that? Furthermore, if you cannot justify that offense, does that mean I should stop swearing? I had a friend who got horribly offended by the phrase "fair play" since she considered it 'common'. Many people are offended by the bracelet on my right arm that proclaims "PRIDE" on a rainbow background because they do not like gay people. Is the offense caused by swearing any less inane than the first example or irrational than the second?

All thoughts would be welcome though constructive ones would be preferred .

[standing_alone]

I agree with what you. I don't think I can really say anything to add to it. Really good post! I find it funny how people will be offended when I say "F***!" when something bad happens to me, but someone can say worse things to another person (insulting them and such) without curse words and that's not as bad as me saying "F***." Kind of makes no sense to me. I mean, they're just words. I understand context and all, but if I accidently hurt myself or something unexpected happens, why is it so bad to use one of these "curse" or "swear" words? How is that "hurtful" or "offensive" to other people?

[Sunstone]

I do think a case could be made that the overuse of a swear word can be just as tedious as any cliche can be. Swear words are, after all, cliches to begin with, so it's easy to overuse them.

But in general, I agree with your thesis, Fluffy. The prohibitions on the use of swear words seem in most respects to be about as arbitrary as which side of the road a nation drives on.

[mr.guy]

Originally Posted by fluffy

The meaning of the word is also easy to refute. If there was something intrinsically taboo about the meaning then people would have the same reaction to that meaning regardless of what word was used to refer to it.

This is a twisting of a word's "meaning".

[Buttercup]

In social parameters I think it's reasonable to leave swearing for private company, especially if children are present. And many elderly people don't appreciate swearing in their presence so it's respectful to refrain while in their company.

Having said that, in essence I look at swearing as just another way to use words to describe the point you are trying to get across. And sometimes a swear word fits perfectly, especially when you stub your tender bare toe on a brick wall. I know I feel TONS better when I scream an obscenity after mauling myself than simply exclaiming....."Oh fiddlesticks!". And because I don't swear too often, I have a really good time when let loose to do so.

In the end it's about respect where swearing is concerned in my mind. Sometimes it's inappropriate because of our current societal norms and sometimes swearing is an anything goes kind of affair. Just depends.

[Draka]

I don't like the use of certain words around children, if only of the mere fact that they pick up and repeat everything they hear and those words bring shock to adults around. Best not to have them even have the knowledge of them to say them in the first place.

Other than that, I have no problem with swear words. You certainly can't offend me with them, since I on rare occasion meet someone who knows more than I do or interesting little ways to use them that's what I get for spending 5 years in the Navy. There is a reason it's called "cussing like a sailor" . They are just words, and sometimes they are the best ways to express extreme things without sounding totally gosh durn diddly ridiculously Ned Flanders.

[Ðanisty]

Most people in society have a largely negative view of swearing.

Do you really think it's most people? I must move in strange circles. I would say that most people swear themselves and really don't care that much. In my experience it's been the few uptight people who have a problem with it. My mom has a problem with the word f***, but not with any other swear words. She finds that word particularly offensive (and it also happens to be the word I use most often...lol.)

The problem I have with swear words being taboo is that people are just going to replace them with other words like crap, darn, heck and screw. And then in circles where those words are considered swear words, they find other words to replace them.

Personally, I put forth an honest effort not to swear in front of children arbitrarily, but if I stub my toe or something, it's going to happen. If that happens, I do apologize to the parents and I do tell the kids they shouldn't repeat it (not that it does any good, but then that's not really my problem, is it?) As far as old people being offended, well, I try to be respectful of elderly people, but they're just going to have to deal with my cussing and if they don't like it, they don't have to be around me. It's not like I have any elderly family members anyway.

Originally Posted by Draka

You certainly can't offend me with them, since I on rare occasion meet someone who knows more than I do or interesting little ways to use them that's what I get for spending 5 years in the Navy. There is a reason it's called "cussing like a sailor"

Growing up, I had one brother in the Navy and the other one was a mechanic. Then I started working as a tattoo artist and I think most people can probably imagine the kind of language tattoo artists use.

I would have to honestly say that not one day goes by where I don't swear. I usually probably swear about 25 times a day in casual conversation. For me, they're just words. If I'm mad, I could probably swear 5 times in one sentence.

[mr.guy]

Originally Posted by daenisty

The problem I have with swear words being taboo is that people are just going to replace them with other words like crap, darn, heck and screw. And then in circles where those words are considered swear words, they find other words to replace them.

Why is this a problem?

[Tigress]

Though I will attempt to respect the wishes of those who oppose the use of 'curse words,' both in public and in their homes, I still think it's making a mountain out of a mole hill.

[Smoke]

Originally Posted by Buttercup

In social parameters I think it's reasonable to leave swearing for private company, especially if children are present. And many elderly people don't appreciate swearing in their presense so it's repectful to refrain while in their company.

I do try not to let fly with too much profanity if I think elderly people are likely to be offended; however, most of the old people I know have seen and heard a great deal more in their lives than you might think, and are hard to shock.

As for children, my grandfather, father and uncle swore in front of me all the time when I was a kid, and I ... well, come to think of it, that might be an argument against it.

Originally Posted by Buttercup

And sometimes a swear word fits perfectly, especially when you stub your tender bare toe on a brick wall. I know I feel TONS better when I scream an obsenity after mauling myself than simply exclaiming....."Oh fiddlesticks!".

Sometimes, only the best will do.

Originally Posted by Buttercup

And because I don't swear too often, I have a really good time when let loose to do so.

It's also more effective with other people. I know I should reserve profanity for when I need it, because if people have never heard you use profanity before, it really captures their attention when you do.

Originally Posted by Buttercup

In the end it's about respect where swearing is concerned in my mind. Sometimes it's inappropriate because of our current societal norms and sometimes swearing is an anything goes kind of affair. Just depends.

My grandfather had a quick temper and a colorful vocabulary, and the older I get, the more I remind myself of him. I hope I've eliminated his racial and ethnic epithets from my vocabulary (except when telling stories about him), and I try not to let fly with so much blasphemy around people likely to be offended -- unless I mean to offend them. Still, sometimes it's hard to judge correctly.

I do think it's perfectly natural and perfectly moral to use good, earthy, four-letter Anglo-Saxon words instead of mealy-mouthed euphemisms, but I will attempt to restrain myself under certain circumstances.