Is it better to be a believer or an athiest? (beliefs, soul)

[Ormiston]

Originally Posted by sky87

okay i get what you're saying, i don't think that we will ever come to a consensus on this, but what about love? is that some chemical reaction?

Ahhhh, love. Everyone wants love....just kidding around. What about joy? What about sorrow? What about happiness? What the heck is love anyways? Why is it so special? Arn't these other emotions as important to us as love? Either they are all supernatural or none of them are supernatural. You pick. What about boredom or being angry. Are these chemical reactions, supernatural events, or a result of our consciousness? I pick number three. They are our perception and explanation induced by our entire physiological being and the environment in which it exists. It is all in our heads.

[sky87]

alright then. now this is going to be a hard idea to get across, but im gonna try. since i am a firm believer, to me supernatural is natural, do you get it? there is no such thing as "super" natural, because god is natural, we just can't see him, but we can feel him, god is there, anything that we can see or something that we know exists is natural to us, like a bird or an animal, they are all part of nature, well what about god? we can't see him, but we can see evidence of him everywhere! everything is so perfectly designed for the sustainance of life on earth, the sun gives perfect amounts of energy, every little atom is designed with such detail, where there is such detail there is intelligence, and where there is such a design there is a designer! just look at the big bang for instance, someone had to place that little unit there, the little unit which expanded into the universe we know of today. sure the little unit took a long time expanding, and you can say that that contradicts the bible or the qur'ans saying that the world was created in six days, but how do you know that our six days are equivalent to god's six days? they aren't, for example in islam one day during judgement day will be equal to many hundreds of a normal day on earth! just the idea of us being happy or being sad, there is a notion of life in there, when you say that its all just in our heads, it makes you feel almost "lifeless", to me something is alive when it has a soul, a spirit, and this spirit is created by a higher energy force, which is god.

[Majikthise]

Originally Posted by Ormiston

It is all in our heads.

Or maybe our glands?

[Ormiston]

Originally Posted by sky87

alright then. now this is going to be a hard idea to get across, but im gonna try. since i am a firm believer, to me supernatural is natural, do you get it? there is no such thing as "super" natural, because god is natural, we just can't see him, but we can feel him, god is there, anything that we can see or something that we know exists is natural to us, like a bird or an animal, they are all part of nature, well what about god? we can't see him, but we can see evidence of him everywhere! everything is so perfectly designed for the sustainance of life on earth, the sun gives perfect amounts of energy, every little atom is designed with such detail, where there is such detail there is intelligence, and where there is such a design there is a designer! just look at the big bang for instance, someone had to place that little unit there, the little unit which expanded into the universe we know of today. sure the little unit took a long time expanding, and you can say that that contradicts the bible or the qur'ans saying that the world was created in six days, but how do you know that our six days are equivalent to god's six days? they aren't, for example in islam one day during judgement day will be equal to many hundreds of a normal day on earth! just the idea of us being happy or being sad, there is a notion of life in there, when you say that its all just in our heads, it makes you feel almost "lifeless", to me something is alive when it has a soul, a spirit, and this spirit is created by a higher energy force, which is god.

I understand your thoughts. But I don't feel the same way. I did once, but that was with the aid of illegal substances. I actually like simply feeling alive. I don't feel lifeless without a soul or a God. I feel just simply blessed to be alive and that's more than good enough for me. Do religious folk have low self-esteem or something? Give yourselves a little respect. Enjoy being a human being and stop taking yourself for granted. It's nice to be alive. We're not perfect but we're not pitiful or sinful or any other such nonsense. I know that was somewhat rude and off-topic but it is how I feel, often.

[Majikthise]

Originally Posted by Ormiston

I feel just simply blessed to be alive and that's more than good enough for me. .

Yes.

[randb]

lol... This was just a thought... I'm not trying to change anyone's beliefs here.. I'm athiestic myself.

[roli]

Originally Posted by Ormiston

So you would agree that insanity and halucinations are absolutely the greatest experiences possible because they produce limitless faith which inturn opens up mysteries and hidden secrets typically left closed to the sane? Some have self-respect for what we believe in.

I believe to be quite sane and am not a madman and therefore have no idea what sort of an experience insanity and halucinations would create as a matter of fact I'm not quite sure what relevance that has to do with this experience.
From your apparent antitheists perspective it is not unusual to hear such presuppositional and ignorant (lack of knowledge) jargon.
You seem to speak from a natural, humanistic perspective, as I once did,but as shocking as that may be God does not operate on your level of understanding or any man's for that matter.

Please read what the wisdom of the world is to God, HE laughs and scoffs at it all,so don't be surprised on that great and glorious day when you with your wisdom ,ideologies and philosophies are but mere excuses from a finite being.
1Cr 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
1Cr 1:21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
1Cr 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
1Cr 1:25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
1Cr 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.
1Cr 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.

IF your not looking for God you won't find Him and the experience and confirmation of that is not yours to be had or for that matter understand. God and his revealtion of himself to his people is not an equation that can be computed nor does it work on the level of logic as we all know logic to be.
If so he would be just another belief system.
It only comes to those who believe that Jesus died for your sins, it's at the sincere moment in the heart of that person that the Holy Spirit indwells that believer,but hey! most, if not all avoid ,deny,ignore ,refute etc the existence of God for many reasons, but the #1 reason why most do this is that they don't want their sins (violation of Gods Law) to be exposed, confronted and revealed

When I say expereince I don't mean a one time encounter eg: I went to church felt some hair stand up", I mean a supernatural encounter from God,that is based on love ,compassion forgiveness, and mercy

[Victor]

Originally Posted by Ormiston

I don't discredit religious folks one bit! You're a religious guy and I think you're one of the greatest contributors to this website. My point is that it's all folks, religious or not, that should get the credit and not any one or the collective whole of religion. Giving thanks to God for us being here is fine with me but the "Giving thanks to God" is not what got us here.

Ormiston, I really thought you were trying to discredit religion. I read one of your previous post and tried to read it all in context.

Originally Posted by Ormiston

And you credit religion!? I credit man.

I apologize for the misunderstanding if you meant otherwise and I agree.

Peace be with you.

[sky87]

Originally Posted by Ormiston

I understand your thoughts. But I don't feel the same way. I did once, but that was with the aid of illegal substances. I actually like simply feeling alive. I don't feel lifeless without a soul or a God. I feel just simply blessed to be alive and that's more than good enough for me. Do religious folk have low self-esteem or something? Give yourselves a little respect. Enjoy being a human being and stop taking yourself for granted. It's nice to be alive. We're not perfect but we're not pitiful or sinful or any other such nonsense. I know that was somewhat rude and off-topic but it is how I feel, often.

you feel "blessed" to be alive? kinda awkward to say especially since you said that you didn't "feel" the same way..

[Ormiston]

Originally Posted by sky87

you feel "blessed" to be alive? kinda awkward to say especially since you said that you didn't "feel" the same way..

We agree we both feel blessed but I don't agree that I feel God. Maybe I should have said that I feel lucky to be alive. Do we still feel the same way?