Huang Po.... (beliefs, experience, eternal, Zen)

[Comet]

I'd like to have a discussion about these texts with my Buddhist friends... even the Hindus, Taoists, et al....

Thanks to Ben D for sending me these (I'll post a bit at a time):

The Master said to me: All the Buddhas and all sentient beings are nothing but the One Mind, beside which nothing exists. This mind, which is without beginning, is unborn and indestructible. It is not of any colour and has neither form or appearance. It does not belong to the categories of things which exist or do not exist, nor can it be thought of as in terms of time, past or future. It can't be described by any words or numbers for it transcends all limits, measures, names, traces, and comparisons. It is that which you see before you -- begin to reason about it and you fall into error. It is like a boundless void which can't be fathomed or measured.

- Teaching of Huang Po

I'd really like to discuss this with others who seem to view things closer to my beliefs than others do... any thoughts on this paragraph?

(thanks- Comet)

[ben d]

Originally Posted by Comet

- Teaching of Huang Po

I'd really like to discuss this with others who seem to view things closer to my beliefs than others do... any thoughts on this paragraph?

(thanks- Comet)

No bites yet so I might just have a nibble on the opening line.

"All the Buddhas and all sentient beings are nothing but the One Mind, beside which nothing exists."

The 'One' of 'One Mind' I understand to be a concept that represents all that exists and all that does not exist, i.e.Absoluteness. The 'Mind' of 'One Mind' I understand to be a concept representing omnipresent awareness.

All the Buddhas and all sentient beings are not essentially separate from the One Mind, and couldn't be for there is nothing else.

[zenzero]

Friend Comet,
One has to meditate on those lines for days / years to really get into that statement.
Resoning MAY be a begining but not an end.
End is when one becomes THAT.
Love & rgds

[lilithu]

Originally Posted by ben d

"All the Buddhas and all sentient beings are nothing but the One Mind, beside which nothing exists."

Makes sense to me. (Don't worry ZZ; I'm not claiming that I have more than an intellectual understanding.)

Was just thinking about this yesterday - does this include sentient beings that used to and will exist? Or just the ones that currently exist? What I mean is, I don't believe in an eternal, unchanging, independent soul. I believe we are but part of the One. But yesterday it occurred to me that even if this is the case, the One may go on remembering even when the many "ones" have rejoined the One.

[zenzero]

Friend liithu,
This is the most difficult part.
to *LET GO* of the ego which is also called the mind.
Even when one drops it [mind] It [mind] finds its way back through another door. The more one opens the more doors and windows too open.
However by constant awareness one can get hold of the mind. Not that myself have it in contol but still only trying at all times possible and keep failing too. Since time is immaterial have all the time and so patience to get back to it.
Yes, about your ones! and remembering.
Remembering again has to do with the mind.
Everything occupies a time and space. The one that joins the one has transended all time and space and their mind is the one mind which does not need to remember. WHY? because for them everything is in front of them. Whatever you talk of, they know from which time / space zone you are talking about and no memory function is required.
Friend Liluthu,
One has to always start from a point; like you I too started from the intellectual understanding But as mentioned making efforts to drop that mind and convert understandings to real experiences and the only way which is known is meditation.
Love & rgds

[Comet]

Thank you for the replies as Ben D and I have been discussing this for over a week already. It is very nice to have others chime in on this.

And Zenzero.... I have mediated on the concept for many years now, just the first time this text has come into my sight.

Lilithu, good questions....

[Comet]

The One Mind alone is the Buddha and there is no distinction between buddhas and mortal beings. But that mortals, by identifying with form, seek externally for buddhahood. By their very seeking they lose it, for that is using the buddha to seek the Buddha. For that is using mind to find Mind. They do not know that, if they were to cease conceptual thought processes, the Buddha is realized, for this mind is the buddha and the Buddha is all sentient beings. It is not the less for being manifested in ordinary entities, not is it greater for being manifested in the buddhas.

Huang Po post #2. I believe that covers much of what zenzero had to say

[ben d]

Originally Posted by lilithu

Makes sense to me. (Don't worry ZZ; I'm not claiming that I have more than an intellectual understanding.)

Was just thinking about this yesterday - does this include sentient beings that used to and will exist? Or just the ones that currently exist? What I mean is, I don't believe in an eternal, unchanging, independent soul. I believe we are but part of the One. But yesterday it occurred to me that even if this is the case, the One may go on remembering even when the many "ones" have rejoined the One.

lilithu, there is so much to your question/s.

Yes, concerning sentient beings, I understand that it is an unconditional statement that has no time constraint implied,..i.e. sentient beings, period.

Concerning believing or not believing in an independent soul, and related questions, the understanding of these matters will come about through meditating on them and not through belief or non-belief about other's opinions including that of Huang Po. For example you say "I believe we are a part of the One", why do you really need to believe if you truly understood One is all there is?.. there isn't anything that exists that doesn't exist in One, and for that which doesn't exist, it doesn't exist in One.

Concerning "One may go on remembering even when the many "ones" have rejoined the One."

One Mind is all there is, nothing rejoins the One because nothing ever left it as nothing exists outside One. That sentient beings under the sway of ignorance imagine the One to be separate and therefore seek to union with the One is the very error that obscures the Oneness of the One. And as 'synchronicity' would have it, this is addressed in Comet's Huang Po post #2.