new approaches to dharmic teaching ?

[ratikala]

dear dread fish ,

Originally Posted by DreadFish

Sorry, I forgot I had posted in this thread

So, lets see... What I mean is I think the approach of zen is very nonsectarian and can still be valid even without many terms that may be deemed "Buddhist" or things like that. Zen is practical and relatively free of dogma, an approach toward everything you do. So, while it's very free form in many ways, it is defined enough in ways that keep it structured. There is a certain approach and practice, that's defined; yet this approach and practice and free form enough that it can be applied to anything even without dogmatic terms.

But yes, nonetheless, there has to be multiple paths for multiple inclinations.

yes , I think the practice of zen in it self is very much suited to a particular type of person , and again if you look at it closely it has allready evolved to suit many different "inclinations" as it has traveled from india to china and from china to korea and japan , yet the principle of dhyana ; absorbtion or meditation is common to both indian traditions buddhism and hinduism ,but as is typical of the japanese mind it has taken on an almost poetic simplicity and a high degree of dicipline .
It is the approach to practice you mention that gives it its distinct quality in that it can be applied to every aspect of life , it is this mindfullness that we could well aply to any dharma practice be it buddhist or hindu , it is the dicipline of practice that absorbs it self in every action

[ratikala]

dear jainarayan ,

Originally Posted by Jainarayan

Yes, indeed. Materialism and technology have good and bad effects. People have better health because of technology, specifically medical technology. But otoh, because of technology, we are not physically active nor have the time for family and communal living. So we need the medical technology!

jai jai ,
not only are we physicaly inactive but we are also focusing our attentions in the wrong places , so as a result we are spiritualy in active , we have become a consumerist society there are so many distractions , so many advancements for us to play with , to indulge ourselves in .so as you outline here we are becoming phisicaly unhealthy , likewise we are becoming spiritualy unhealthy .
what we need is proportionate thinking and how can we think proportionately when we are not given the basic information ?
you are a fortunate soul in that you have a strong desire to find a spiritual balance in your life , you have actively been searching .
but many are stuck in an unsatifactory lifestyle without any knowledge that it could be different .

There was a time when you awoke before dawn to begin chores: bread was baked and foods cooked every day; people in cities walked everywhere; at sunset, you were indoors only doing things you could do with candles or oil lamps, and spending time together. Would I want to live that way? Absolutely. Is that a fantasy? Probably.

Ha ha .. we may very well have to , the technology that was intended to liberate us has merely caused a new set of problems , we forget that allthough the originators of most descoveries have worked tirelessly for the betterment of mankind that these technologies are made available to us by the comercial sector , and such is life that they have packaged and sold us a lifestyle that is un sustainable , not only that but allso the cost of subscribing to this lifestyle is beyond many peoples reach , and now a new form of dissatisfaction is rearing its head , we have been told how we should live , but it is not within the reach of all, all the time that these technologies are in the hands of the comercial sector ther is a great risk of their abuse for the sake of financial gain.
there may well come a time when we need to return to a more natural lifestyle , and to be content with a little more simplicity !

this brings me back to the original question , ... how to bring the awareness of dharma back in to the every day life of a larger section of the comunity ?

[Jainarayan]

At the risk of using clichés, sometimes we can unleash a force that becomes to great to control, and takes over. The genie is out of the bottle, and he ain't going back in. I think this is what our society has become, an uncontrollable force turning on us. The only way we'll ever go back is by bombing ourselves back to the stone age.

[ratikala]

Originally Posted by Jainarayan

At the risk of using clichés, sometimes we can unleash a force that becomes to great to control, and takes over. The genie is out of the bottle, and he ain't going back in. I think this is what our society has become, an uncontrollable force turning on us. The only way we'll ever go back is by bombing ourselves back to the stone age.

or there is allways the other cliched expression "become part of the solution not part of the problem"

no seriously !!!

having seen the destructive and self centered direction that the world is taking ,, can we realy sit back and just let it happen ?

I am not talking about religious prostelatising , I am simply advocating promoting the benifits of folowing a dharmic path , living by the yamas and niyamas .

the ten clasic yamas

Ahimsa : Nonviolence. not causing the suffering of any living being through our own bodily actions nor through our speach , thought or intention .
Satya : truthfulness.
Asteya : non-stealing, non-coveting,
Bramacharia : abstainance , fault less conduct , (celibate when single, faithful when married)
Kshama : tollerence , patience .
Dhriti : steadfastness .
Daya : compassion , overcoming ill will .
Arjava : truthfullness, straightforwardness ,(without deceipt and deception)
Mitahara : moderation in appetite ,(neither eating or sleeping too much or too little)
Shaucha : purity , (of body , speech and mind)

contemplate each and for oneself weigh up the benifits , I defy any truthfull human being to find anything but benifit in such conduct when carefully considered .

[Vinayaka]

Nice ... here's another cliche .. walk the walk, versus talk the talk I think there should be more focus on the former. (obviously) Hindu ethics - Yamas, Niyamas

[Jainarayan]

Originally Posted by ratikala

or there is allways the other cliched expression "become part of the solution not part of the problem"

no seriously !!!

having seen the destructive and self centered direction that the world is taking ,, can we realy sit back and just let it happen ?

I am not talking about religious prostelatising , I am simply advocating promoting the benifits of folowing a dharmic path , living by the yamas and niyamas .

the ten clasic yamas

Ahimsa : Nonviolence. not causing the suffering of any living being through our own bodily actions nor through our speach , thought or intention .
Satya : truthfulness.
Asteya : non-stealing, non-coveting,
Bramacharia : abstainance , fault less conduct , (celibate when single, faithful when married)
Kshama : tollerence , patience .
Dhriti : steadfastness .
Daya : compassion , overcoming ill will .
Arjava : truthfullness, straightforwardness ,(without deceipt and deception)
Mitahara : moderation in appetite ,(neither eating or sleeping too much or too little)
Shaucha : purity , (of body , speech and mind)

contemplate each and for oneself weigh up the benifits , I defy any truthfull human being to find anything but benifit in such conduct when carefully considered .

Originally Posted by Vinayaka

Nice ... here's another cliche .. walk the walk, versus talk the talk I think there should be more focus on the former. (obviously) Hindu ethics - Yamas, Niyamas

Actually I agree. I was being tongue-in-cheek about bombing back to the stone age. I believe that by practicing the Yamas and Niyamas, we'll find our way. But I don''t know how to get 7 billion people on-board with this idea and change their ways. For myself, this is a goal... "think globally, act locally" as the slogan goes for recycling and respecting Bhūmī-Devī, applying it to living a dharmic life, starting with myself. 6,999,999,997 people to go (we've already started ).

[ratikala]

dear jainarayan ,

Originally Posted by Jainarayan

Actually I agree. I was being tongue-in-cheek about bombing back to the stone age. I believe that by practicing the Yamas and Niyamas, we'll find our way. But I don''t know how to get 7 billion people on-board with this idea and change their ways. For myself, this is a goal... "think globally, act locally" as the slogan goes for recycling and respecting Bhūmī-Devī, applying it to living a dharmic life, starting with myself. 6,999,999,997 people to go (we've already started ).

jai jai , only 6,999, 999,997 to go , and sure we can add many members of the hindu and buddhist fraternity , and some more good souls infact many christians and muslims I have met keep many of the principles , so ok the more we study them the more we perfect our aplication

ok so how do we convince an athiest to follow a dharmic path? .... so you dont believe in god , .....just contemplate the "do as you would be done by" principle
and Im not saying that all athiests are immoral , what I am saying is that all of us could improve our behavior if we study a systematic path , we all pick up behavioral habits from the society around us so we need to look carefully at our conditioned responces , do we actualy agree with the things we find our self doing , if we saw someone else doing what we are doing , what would we truely think ?

Its all about how honest we can be ?
and as vinayaka said , are we prepaired to walk the walk ?

[Jainarayan]

That's all exactly true. I think all we can do is lead by example and/or we need an appearance of God in the form of a great teacher. The saints and swamis of the past century (Sri Ramakrishna, Sri Swami Vivekananda, Paramahansa Yogananda, et. al.) were on the right road and making progress, but their work seems to have been lost on the general population. Maybe they were paving the way for the next great one.

[Vinayaka]

My father was an atheist. He knew nothing at all about dharma. That is, he knew nothing at all intellectually about dharma. He'd never heard of it, and certainly wasn't about to sit in on any lecture about it, nor any other religion. He'd seen the hypocrisy in the local Christian Church on Sunday mornings when people talked the talk, but then the rest of the week were off boozing it up, playing the field (I don't mean farmer's fields), cheating on their taxes, cheating their neighbours, boasting of accomplishments. His common sense of decency gave him a reputation as a good man, a loyal husband, a law-abiding citizen, a good father. He was a better Christian than half the Christians out there.

Unlike him, I am not as bothered by the hypocrisy, (It does bother me, but not as much as with him) but only a fool would say it doesn't exist in 'dharmic' religions. I've seen some pretty ridiculous things go on in the name of dharma, or by so called 'followers' of it. Maybe I'm just too old.

[ratikala]

dear vinayaka ji

sounds like my nana ,

just a good human being , A rare and wonderfull being

Originally Posted by Vinayaka

but only a fool would say it doesn't exist in 'dharmic' religions. I've seen some pretty ridiculous things go on in the name of dharma, or by so called 'followers' of it. Maybe I'm just too old.

un fortunately I have to agree here , so maybe I'm too old as well , mind you even when I was little my nana used to say that I had an old head on young sholders ,
she said a lot of things that make perfect sence especialy from the vedic perspective .

and as for the crazy things which happen in the name of dharma ?? Hmmm...... sometimes I contemplate just how far tolerance should go ?
but at the end of the day I simply find myself going further and further in to my own world , my relationship (through service) with the lord .

but was your father an athiest because he didnt want to be a part of the hypocracy that he saw ? or was he simply content with his own take on life ?