Christian hedonist video (Jesus Christ, Earth, disciples, Revelation, worship) - Page 2

FerventGodSeeker · #11 06-12-2007, 05:50 PM

Isn't there more or less a happy medium between the two? The way I've always viewed it is that we can be happy and hopeful in spite of trial and tribulation because our trust is in God, and because such negative events ultimately have a constructive purpose in God's plan.

Special Revelation · #12 06-12-2007, 10:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angellous_evangellous

It's a marketing scam for cheap Christianity.

"All men seek happiness. This is without exception. Whatever different means they employ, they all tend to this end. The cause of some going to war, and others avoiding it, is the desire in both, attended with different views. The will never takes the least step but to this object. This is the motive of every action of every man, even those who hang themselves."
Blaise Pascal

From the book Desiring God by John Piper, page 16

Angellous,
If Blaise Pascal is correct, where are you seeking your personal happiness? Are you trying to find your happiness in yourself, or material things, or fame, or attention? I choose to find happiness in God. The Word of God tells us to delight in the Lord, rejoice in Him, to treasure Christ above all things, to praise Him. Who really has the cheap Christianity?

angellous_evangellous · #13 06-13-2007, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Special Revelation

"All men seek happiness. This is without exception. Whatever different means they employ, they all tend to this end. The cause of some going to war, and others avoiding it, is the desire in both, attended with different views. The will never takes the least step but to this object. This is the motive of every action of every man, even those who hang themselves."
Blaise Pascal

From the book Desiring God by John Piper, page 16

Angellous,
If Blaise Pascal is correct, where are you seeking your personal happiness? Are you trying to find your happiness in yourself, or material things, or fame, or attention? I choose to find happiness in God. The Word of God tells us to delight in the Lord, rejoice in Him, to treasure Christ above all things, to praise Him. Who really has the cheap Christianity?

Pascal didn't come up with this - he's following Aristotle and Socrates in their anthropological assumptions. He may be correct, and he definately follows Aristotle ((1214a) Eudemian Ethics (or Ethica Eudemia)) in that our seeking of happiness can be either constructive (if we seek it according to reason) or destructive (if we seek it according to passion).

The cheapening of the Christian message is making happiness the focus of the Christian life, as Piper does in his book. Happiness may be one aspect of Christianity, and certianly Christians can delight in the Lord, but this is a secondary aspect of Christianity and not the primary one. Our primary focus is renewal of the world through suffering, and our personal focus is the redemption of ourselves and those around us through suffering.

Special Revelation · #14 06-13-2007, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angellous_evangellous

Pascal didn't come up with this - he's following Aristotle and Socrates in their anthropological assumptions. He may be correct, and he definately follows Aristotle ((1214a) Eudemian Ethics (or Ethica Eudemia)) in that our seeking of happiness can be either constructive (if we seek it according to reason) or destructive (if we seek it according to passion).

The cheapening of the Christian message is making happiness the focus of the Christian life, as Piper does in his book. Happiness may be one aspect of Christianity, and certianly Christians can delight in the Lord, but this is a secondary aspect of Christianity and not the primary one. Our primary focus is renewal of the world through suffering, and our personal focus is the redemption of ourselves and those around us through suffering.

Thanks Angellous for sharing nicely,
Consider additonnal scripture regarding suffering and trials:

James 1 - Trials and Temptations

Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance. Perseverance must finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything. If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him. But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all he does...
Blessed is the man who perseveres under trial, because when he has stood the test, he will receive the crown of life that God has promised to those who love him.

angellous_evangellous · #15 06-13-2007, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Special Revelation

Thanks Angellous for sharing nicely,
Consider additonnal scripture regarding suffering and trials:

James 1 - Trials and Temptations

Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance. Perseverance must finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything. If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to him. But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all he does...
Blessed is the man who perseveres under trial, because when he has stood the test, he will receive the crown of life that God has promised to those who love him.

Joy and happiness are not the same thing at all.

Special Revelation · #16 06-13-2007, 10:39 AM

It is the will of God for Christians to suffer. How should we suffer? Should we suffer with fear and lack of faith. Or should we suffer with joy, knowing that there is a divine purpose for our suffering as Christians?. Look how Jesus and the disciples suffered, with GREAT JOY (happiness).

Nehemiah 8:10:
Do not grieve, for the joy of the LORD is your strength

1 Thessalonians 1:6:
You became imitators of us and of the Lord; in spite of severe suffering, you welcomed the message with the joy given by the Holy Spirit.

Acts 5:
His speech persuaded them. They called the apostles in and had them flogged. Then they ordered them not to speak in the name of Jesus, and let them go.
The apostles left the Sanhedrin, rejoicing because they had been counted worthy of suffering disgrace for the Name. Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Christ.

Hebrews 12:2:
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.

angellous_evangellous · #17 06-13-2007, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Special Revelation

It is the will of God for Christians to suffer. How should we suffer? Should we suffer with fear and lack of faith. Or should we suffer with joy, knowing that there is a divine purpose for our suffering as Christians?. Look how Jesus and the disciples suffered, with GREAT JOY (happiness).

Nehemiah 8:10:
Do not grieve, for the joy of the LORD is your strength

1 Thessalonians 1:6:
You became imitators of us and of the Lord; in spite of severe suffering, you welcomed the message with the joy given by the Holy Spirit.

Acts 5:
His speech persuaded them. They called the apostles in and had them flogged. Then they ordered them not to speak in the name of Jesus, and let them go.
The apostles left the Sanhedrin, rejoicing because they had been counted worthy of suffering disgrace for the Name. Day after day, in the temple courts and from house to house, they never stopped teaching and proclaiming the good news that Jesus is the Christ.

Hebrews 12:2:
Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.

Equating joy with happiness is as impossible in English as it is in Greek. There is no such thing as Christian happiness, and it is completely incompatible with the concept of joy.

Special Revelation · #18 06-13-2007, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angellous_evangellous

Equating joy with happiness is as impossible in English as it is in Greek. There is no such thing as Christian happiness, and it is completely incompatible with the concept of joy.

Hedonism = a life devoted to pleasure.
Christian hedonism = a life devoted to pleasure in God!

Does God command us to be a Christian Hedonist? Let's start posting scriptures about rejoicing, praising, enjoying, and taking great pleasure in God.

Psalm 37:4: Delight yourself in the LORD and he will give you the desires of your heart.